File: 1714950675663.jpeg (145.58 KB, 1269x1573, 1679618581740.jpeg)
No. 1991983
This thread is to discuss your grievances with gender ideology.
>What is gender ideology? Foundational to transgenderism, gender ideology is the belief that one’s “internal gender” can contradict one’s biological sex.
Gender ideology operates much like a religious cult. There is no scientific evidence that supports the notion that we have an “internal gender,” and yet doctors now medicalize and sterilize children with “transgender identities” who have been groomed by the cult. Anyone who does not reaffirm these delusions is labelled as a “transphobe” in order to discredit any dissenting voices of the cult.
Previous thread:
>>>/ot/1941872Relevant /snow/ threads:
>>>/snow/1987643 (MTF general)
>>>/snow/1984807 (FTM general)
No. 1992067
File: 1714958091855.gif (607.22 KB, 500x360, 1000001597.gif)
How long until they undo letting trannies in women sports? How many women need to get injured for them to stop enabling?
No. 1992125
File: 1714962459660.png (5.71 MB, 2720x2720, timchart.png)
No. 1992152
File: 1714964740666.png (357.59 KB, 587x695, Screenshot 2024-05-05 001408.p…)
I really despise how they have to take the most mundane things and smother them with their gendie crap. As somebody who wore these shorts and never trooned out, i was quite triggered by this. If anything, these shorts have always reminded of Ryan from high school musical.
No. 1992240
File: 1714973665399.png (42.29 KB, 598x500, marshal.png)
If Marsha wasn't trannywashed by the TQ+ community, his death wouldn't have been mentioned as "a crime against black queer and trans people". Murder or suicide, let that man rest like the drag queen he said he was, not a TIM that made something "revolutionary".
No. 1992248
>>1992125KEK this is my first time seeing the TIM version. Also
>lawful hsts blaire white>neutral hsts jazz jenningsWhat about Contra and PT though? Lawful AGPs?
No. 1992275
File: 1714978242893.png (206.37 KB, 500x500, 1659060290285.png)
>>1992125KEK nona you are the best ♥
No. 1992276
>>1992267>Kind of want to protect chaotic HSTS I get it, the one non-AGP troon i knew was some gay kid from HS who was trafficked as a minor and constantly hung out with dangerous men. He was chaotic HSTS through and through. Everyone around him (us) was extremely homophobic, it was obvious his 'transition' came along things like prostitution and being singled out for being effeminate. HSTS troons like this are among the few TiMs i actually feel like defending and being concerned about, you could argue they were child
victims of gender ideology before it was even mainstream.
No. 1992604
File: 1715012658304.jpg (43.61 KB, 785x370, Va07z6n8i861.jpg)
It's hilarious witnessing absolute consoomers(some of whom I know were once die-hard HP fans) make a complete U-turn and behave as if it's the most worst thing imaginable and that they've always known about it. `
No. 1992621
>>1992604I interacted with people who really think like this and it's funny how they are always fans of authors that are actually "
problematic" like they describe but don't seem like they understand what they just read or make excuses for these (male) authors, a big example is Lovecraft. Poor guy, he is just a product of his time and he deeply regretted it all in the end, don't you know…
No. 1992667
>>1992621Lovecraft: So racist he even called his cat "n-" and said they should stay away from white people.
Everybody: Oh it was product of his time.
JK Rowling: Women should stay safe of TIMs
Everybody: She's literal Hitler!
No. 1992713
File: 1715021409115.png (437.92 KB, 1200x675, BJGoIFN.png)
>>1992125The neutral HSTS is Jazz?
No. 1992736
>>1992604the way these people act you would think JKR is Literally Hitler and not a past DV
victim advocating to keep men out of women's spaces. it's jarring to think about how this was a non-controversial opinion a mere 10-20 years ago. it's almost hilarious how these same idiots typically have nothing to say about other ~controversial~ media figures (Johnny Depp, Brad Pitt, etc.) so long as they beat their wives.
>Harry Potter books are full of racism, xenophobia holy fuck, i'm not even an HP fan, but it's obvious she's calling attention to how bad these things are. i suppose you would need to have reading comprehension skills better than a four-year-old's to understand, so that explains why gendies can't process this.
>antisemitismif you see a strange, mythical creature who operates a bank and immediately think "Jew!!" then maybe you're the antisemite
No. 1992737
>>1992125>The giant hands with Laful HSTSKekkkk
nonnie,ily this is great
No. 1992810
File: 1715028456690.jpg (34.91 KB, 1079x362, 20240506_212631.jpg)
Someone was pointing out the extremely high rates of sex offenders among TiMs in the replies to a JKR tweet. Troons swarmed to accuse the poster of lying and one of them posted these numbers. Do they not realize how their own propaganda contradicts them? A child could look at these numbers and immediately tell rates of sex offenses are much higher for TiMs (58.9% for TiMs vs 3% for women). In fact they even surpass men (16%). I'm sure the numbers would be much higher for men if we correctly prosecuted rapes and SA but it does say something that troons are abnormally prone to antisocial conduct when it comes to sex, even by moid standards. If i was a TiM i'd crawl back to my mancave and never ever bring up politics after seeing how i belong to one of the most rapey demographics ever.
No. 1992878
>>1992810Why’re they pretending to have no idea about this? I understand some of them are ashamed of their rapeape compatriots and are seeking to distance themselves, because they’re not like other men, but they didn’t actually change reality by putting on a dress. Just because they claimed oppression doesn’t mean they escaped from the predators in their ranks. The predators are still there just using these morons as cover.
The only way for them to fix this is to start policing their own community but they won’t do that because they’re all sexual deviants sexually harassing people by wearing their fetish in public and they can’t draw attention to it because then they’d have to confront the fact they’re still men acting like men.
No. 1993406
>>1992125>protectThe HSTS guys
>send to psych ward for treatmentNeutral enby, neutral AGP
>killThe rest
No. 1993500
File: 1715054000521.png (848.73 KB, 1007x764, tru self.PNG)
Does anyone else hate this pipeline?
No. 1993513
>>1993503it’s men in womanface, for one. can you see the problem with blackface?
if they kept it to themselves, that would be one thing, but we’re forced to enable their weird fetish and let them into our spaces because of it.
No. 1993516
>>1993503Gender critical isn't founded on hatred in the first place. There is no need to believe in a black and white good and evil to disagree with the ideology. Many of them are indeed well-meaning ordinary people trying to cope with body dysmorphia and internalised homophobia/misogyny. So? what Their core belief system is wrong. You don't have to agree with it to be understanding or sympathetic to them.
>>1993509Yes, that's what I meant. The "self I was made to be" comment in which she now is wearing a form fitting low-cut dress is what mostly irked me.
No. 1993518
>>1993500Was she just an enby or something? Did she think dressing in a more stereotypically way makes her more woman than how she was in the first picture? I don't really see a journey here, rather just a woman who decided to glow up and stop styling herself in an unflattering way that hides her body, which i support if she is genuinely happy like this.
>>1993503This thread is made specifically for venting on this issue so you're good. I am autistic too, but the thing that peaked me is learning about how harmful hrt and srs was and learning about agps. I don't actually wish all troons death, i don't even think the most hardcore terfs really thing that either since many of them can still be reformed. The idea that gender critical people hate troons is a narrative that troons push to get more people to feel sorry for them and to demonise the opposition no matter how logical the said opposition is. After learning that there is a whole entire industry that seeks to squeeze money out of people who need serious mental help by encouraging them to mutilate themselves instead of helping them build coping mechanisms and learn to love themselves, i can't support such a thing in any capacity, along with the fact that so much of trans rights concerning mtf seek to override the safety and boundaries of females, whilst males seem to be left unscathed in the matter. All the hate that trans people get is largely because of the content of their character because a lot of them present with blatant narcissistic traits.
No. 1993545
>>1993513I guess I feel like I cannot personally think of it as blackface since for a lot of troons it doesn't seem like a joke or intentional mockery and they are legitimately distressed. Yes there is usually harmful stereotypes involved but most don't seem to be doing that particular aspect of their transition maliciously from what I can tell.
>>1993516This mostly makes sense, thank you. I still struggle confidently saying that all troons simply have internalized homophobia or normal BDD if some feel cured from transition. Who am I to say? Maybe none really do and its all a lie but how can one know for sure?
>>1993518The AGP issue is the worst one for me I think. Seeing the 4chan /lgbt/ board and what is said there disgusts me. I think you're right that there is a system that preys on people but it feels wrong to say that I know what's best for everyone. I met an MTF troon IRL once who seemed normal enough and now I feel like I still associate gender stuff with them even when the communities I'm in get ruined from AGPs. It feels wrong for me to hold absolute opinions that would prevent someone like that from living their life in a way that works for them. Sometimes I feel like my problem is that I don't hold stronger convictions on topics that I don't consider important above all else.
Also thank you for the replies. I'm not trying to argue a side (I don't have one) this is just helping me think through this whole thing outside of affirmation bubbles. This topic is so
toxic and hopefully I am not seeming that way. It feels like I'm considered an evil GC in some places and some kind of troon apologist in others. I think having a strong anti-troon culture on the farms is important regardless since it seems like the only way to keep the AGPs from taking over.
No. 1993562
>>1992235I basically know two types of women who do this, the first is the typical kweer/TIF/whatever variety that just thinks being straight is not cool and want the social clout of calling themselves queer, but the other kind is women with really bad trauma issues from dating men who start dabbling in the idea of being gay or 'a kinsey 5' because they've been so traumatized by dating men. I actually have a friend who went through this recently after another
abusive moid dumped her and acted
abusive toward her, where her therapist for some reason floated the idea of her being lesbian actually and she ran with it, even changing her whole wardrobe to try to be 'lesbian coded.' I suspected it was just a weird mental issue and indeed, a few months after insisting she's totally lesbian and wants to meet girls she still spergs with extreme specificity about her standards in men and how and why she finds specific males in the media hot and has said absolutely nothing of the kind about any woman, aside from occasionally remembering she's supposed to be lesbian now and saying something offhandedly about wanting to meet girls. She's not a TIF but I think some of these women if they were a little younger when the trans thing took off would probably become some sort of enby or non-transitioning TIF as well just because trauma around their heterosexual relationships.
I wish it was more common for women to talk to other women and younger girls about how traumatic not just female puberty and treatment of young women/beauty standards are but also about how dark it can be to date men because I think a lot of women end up confused and trying to take refuge in the 'queer' movement because they weren't prepared for how hating shitty men and heterosexual relationship dynamics is a normal thing for straight women to experience.
No. 1993571
>>1993516To me this looks like a very young girl who probably had body image issues/didn't feel very attractive hitting age 19/20 and realizing that she actually can be conventionally attractive and embracing it. A lot of the enby/TIF type girls I knew when I was younger weren't even gay or GNC in any real way, but were just insecure about their looks and felt they couldn't 'match up' to expectations for attractive women. She might be one of those types. I went through this too even though I was not straight and had a fairly 'GNC' personality and interests - I leaned into dressing masculine and covering up my body mostly due to insecurity and feeling I couldn't be attractive, then went through a late teens/early 20s phase of dressing like the stereotypical hot girl when I got over my awkward phase.
>>1993565Yeah I think either weight issues or hitting puberty earlier than other girls and getting made fun of for your big boobs/butt/curviness before you have grown into them facially is a lot of what causes early/mid teens girls to troon out or at least dress GNC and avoid stereotypical gender presentation and boys (even when they're straight). Just because she's dressing like that for presumably a college party or something now doesn't necessarily mean she's femininitymaxxing and thinks she needs to dress like a bimbo all the time, she might have just started liking her body.
No. 1993585
>>1993503>>1993545It's not off-topic for this thread and I used to be where you were at with this so I will take a crack at it. I don't think it is a requirement of being GC to 'hate all troons' although I think a lot of GC women naturally start hating all troons either because they have negative experiences with them all irl or because once they start expressing 'terfier' views online or in person they get attacked by even the seemingly benign, 'good' kinds of troons for their fairly straightforward feminist opinions. For me personally I used to be more amenable to some aspects of gender ideology and have a ton of trans-identified friends/acquaintances but as soon as I started expressing certain GC views I was relentlessly attacked and hounded by even the most benign seeming trans-identified acquaintances, and realized that no matter how many times you want to give an inch they will take a mile and still demand more. I'm the same anon who mentioned on the last thread I had a party where a bunch of TIF/enby girls were discussing a male enby rapist and the only male enby at the party started freaking out at these TIF/nb girls for calling the rapist 'he,' completely bulldozing the entire conversation about a serial rapist to make his feelings matter more than the feelings of his
victims. The troons who seem benign will usually let the mask slip at some point and show that they really don't give a shit about women's and children's rights, safety or feelings and once you have been in that position enough times a lot of GC women give up on trying to befriend or give the benefit of the doubt to 'the good ones.'
But on a more theoretical level, you can't tell people how to live their lives, but those people will probably at some point tell you how you can live your life. Try to introduce laws to take protections and safeguarding away from women legally, or implement laws like C16 in Canada that made it legally punishable not to use someone's preferred pronouns. Which means that women who don't believe men are women are compelled by law to lie to themselves and others publicly that they think these men are women. If it wasn't a zero-sum game that would be one thing but most of these people when you agitate for their right to 'live the way they want' won't do the same for you.
Then there's the grooming aspect - especially of children but adults too - where the medical and pharma industries are lying that puberty blockers are safe and reversible or SRS surgeries give safe and usable results when they don't. This starts being promoted to children, mentally ill people, and just people too stupid to know that the medical industry is lying to them. The only long term studies in existence show that a couple years post-SRS most troons are actually more miserable and suicidal than they were before, because they realized how badly they fucked up their bodies and now they have nonfunctioning genitals, can never orgasm, and a ton of other health issues they can never come back from on top of never being perceived as the sex they want to be perceived as. Also many countries are making taxpayers pay for these surgeries. If someone had full informed consent to get SRS and paid for it out of pocket, it would only be as much of a problem as someone with BID getting a doctor to amputate a healthy limb (which is illegal in most countries btw), but it's so much worse than that because they are lied to about the outcomes and usually taking HRT and cutting out their reproductive organs causes even worse systemic body issues than just amputating a limb would. Early onset osteoporosis, hormonal issues, cognitive issues, etc.
Re: the blackface comparison, is blackface accepted when it's not 'intentional' mockery? Not in our current society. A man doesn't have to think he's mocking a woman to make a mockery of womanhood by being a misogynist and applying misogynistic stereotypes and trying to enact them with skirt go spinny and programmer socks, but it's insulting to actual women anyway. It's a man trying to coopt and appropriate women's experiences using only the most offensive and surface-level markers of femininity. Even if it's not malicious most people take issue with people non-maliciously pretending to be another race, like Rachel Dolezal, who ironically tried to do more for her local black community than 99.999% of troons ever try to do for actual women. Because if you're not black, you don't know what it's like to be black, and if you're not female, you don't know what it's like to be female. Even the fact that you think you can know is insulting and is making a mockery of the people you're LARPing as.
You can't know for sure that zero troons really feel cured from transition but it's interesting that on the rare occasions research has been done, they are worse off post-medical transition than they were before. Again ask yourself why we don't publicly fund skin darkening/lightening for people who think they 'would feel better' as another race, liposuction for anorexics, or amputations for people with BID.
If you met a nice HSTS or AGP once I don't think GC ideology tells you that you need to instantly hate them and think they're evil, many mentally disordered and delusional people might be nice people at the end of the day. But ask yourself if they can really become the opposite sex, and if not, how much should other people be legally and socially forced to treat them like they are the opposite sex? Did the 'nice' troon you know want people to treat them this way under force of legal violence or social censure? If a troon wants to present as 'the opposite sex' but is completely fine with everyone not treating them that way, then maybe they are less
problematic than the rest, but I've found that no troon I've ever talked to is actually OK with just letting other people live as they want, being cordial with people who don't treat them as the sex they're 'presenting' as, don't want any additional legal rights, etc.
No. 1993598
>>1993545I fully get why you're uneasy with generalizations as an autistic person, but recognizing patterns is okay and important. It is not a generalization when GCs point out most troons are driven by fetish, it's just an observable fact, and it doesn't exclude other factors and personal trajectories.
>they are legitimately distressedThat's right, but being legitimately distressed doesn't negate the presence of a fetish based around consuming and objectifying womanhood. It makes perfect sense that men who let their fetish consume their life are distressed. Bear in mind that this distress is often not directly caused by their trans identity. Body dysmorphia, trauma, addictions, being an incel, feeling inadequate are all blamed on their trans struggle. It's a perverse way of shielding their poor choices from critique or a terrible coping mechanism, depending on how you look at it. I cannot stress enough how AGP is common, i've known so many soft guys who seemed alright and distressed by their 'gender' only to see them describe their disgusting fetish once they felt comfortable enough. Yes, even the ones who didn't do 'womanface' or acted lewd or were transbians. The starting point is always 'woman = slut, i want to be slut'. These 'okay TiMS' wouldn't ever bring up their fetish or attempt transition 30 years ago, because they're well-adjusted enough to not let it destroy everything (keep in mind that most AGPs keep it at home). Still, they are men who take advantage of the current context to live out a fantasy at the expense of women. The only ones who never showed such signs were blatantly gay moids, which aligns pretty well with the AGP/HSTS dichotomy. It sounds simplistic, but male sexuality can often be extremely stereotypical and predictable.
No. 1993602
File: 1715066720499.png (1013.07 KB, 1079x1504, W6NqcHw.png)
No. 1993616
>>1993598You made a very good point that in most cases TIMs are driven by legitimate mental distress caused by their own degeneracy, but even if it wasn't degeneracy driving them 'legitimate distress' is such a bad excuse for trying to force other people to play along with your delusions. I am legitimately distressed that as a woman I am physically weaker and less able to defend myself from moids than moids are, but that distress has nothing to do with how people 'see' me and everything to do with the fact that I literally just don't have the punch strength, grip strength, speed etc. that moids do. No amount of begging for people to 'see me' as I would like to be seen will make me competitive with male sprinters or high jumpers or boxers. I am legitimately distressed that I was skinny and pretty for most of my life but got fat due to PCOS and hypothyroidism, but people would think I was legitimately cognitively delayed if I demanded that everyone treat me like a 'skinny person' whatever that means now that I gained weight, and made clothes that fit me that say they're size 00 or were attracted to me the way they are to 110lb women. No amount of feeling legitimately distressed about your physical reality changes your physical reality, and most other people with good reasons for legitimate distress know that and don't expect people to pretend they're, e.g., skinny, or NOT paraplegic/in a wheelchair, or NOT blind, or NOT as fast a runner as the next person, or whatever. Most "legitimate" social causes revolve around people who are honest about their physical and social reality asking for accommodations for that physical and social reality so they are not excluded from society more than they absolutely have to be, they're not asking to literally be included in things they can't possibly be included in. Every other social movement for people distressed about their reality revolves around somewhat improving their reality, not making everyone else play an elaborate childlike game of pretend with them. Paraplegics get to play basketball in their own competitions where they can play in a wheelchair if they're actually fit and strong enough to do that, not play pretend basketball games where people pretend they're running around on 2 legs. This is literally the only mainstream social movement I can think of where the cure for the 'legitimate distress' of a supposedly disenfranchised person is to pretend they are something they're not.
>>1993602Average looking girl making an annoying facial expression becomes somewhat more attractive average looking girl by smiling. Wow!
No. 1993907
File: 1715091127412.png (7.96 MB, 4960x3507, aqqwpo76g5h71.png)
I have half an idea how tumblr just became the perfect breeding ground for trans rights activism. At its peak, it's a fandom blogging site with most users being loser girls who care too much about fiction and lack of conforming with irl peers. In marketing, the word "tribe" means a group of people with the same beliefs, affinities and interests. Thanks to our centuries of lizard brain, people tend to personally connect and champion their "tribes". We feel attacked if our perceived tribe is attacked, and we feel rewarded if our perceived tribe get good things etc. Tumblr easily became a tribe for awkward/autistic girlies who just don't fit in, and inclusivity and understanding naturally follows. There's a culture for being terminally online/fandom addiction, self-deprecating humor, and NLOGism. And to fit in in this new tribe, you had to internalize that. And when the tribe culture is built on not fitting in, you'd have shit escalating like otherkin, transing as the other gender, neogenders/neopronouns etc. It doesn't matter that it uses unquantifiable experiences to tell they're real, everyone has to accept this group of people who don't fit in anywhere, and with the definition so vague, you can be trans, the cool new kid, too. Anyway this is partially my experienced, I ticked a few boxes here. I was bullied and ostracized in school and still working through my awkwardness/mild social anxieties in my adulthood. Tumblr felt like an addicting self-deprecating bucket. I was an NLOG, and at some point I even questioned my gender until I realized that I just like thinking about boys because I'm a straight woman kek. And then I peaked realizing that the tim who sent me genderbent porn to hint that he's a tim groomed me as 5 years his junior.
No. 1994021
File: 1715096589345.jpg (818.51 KB, 567x1566, 1.jpg)
what a load of bs
No. 1994150
>>1994133faghag behaviour kek
but for real though, the troons that admit they are their real sex and basically just crossdress under the label of trans are a lot easier to accept and to have some compassion for. I can accept blaire white for example since he says tims are a type of men, it's still a bit icky to see men cosplay women caricatures but if a gay guy wants to play dress up then sure. But troons like him are hated by most of the trans community
No. 1994234
File: 1715107064419.jpg (267.92 KB, 1570x1416, 1678709160638.jpg)
>>1992125does anyone have the chart like this one but with TIFs? I remember there being a blue-haired MHA fan, one that was just a woman who doesn't wear skirts, etc. here's another TIM one I had saved as payment
No. 1994365
>>1994264I've seen that too here in lc, they use b
tch and cnt like is a comma. At first I thought it was a bunch of fagots but it seems that an influx of tiktoktards and twittfags teenagers are coming to the "radfem IB" for some autistic reason. As someone from a shithole country is bizarre to say the least wanting to "take back" a slur, you don't see people of african descent wanting to take back the n-word, even faggots don't call themselves fagggots in the open so women deluding themselves into thinking they can "take back and own" misogynistic slurs is maximum retardation.
(integrate, don't self censor) No. 1994430
File: 1715121785761.jpeg (271.64 KB, 1264x1827, uU7SQjf.jpeg)
>>1992125>lawful agpKEKKKKK you're a genius
No. 1994516
>>1994248nona this one is good too
>>1994370but this is the one I was looking for!! Thank you ♥
No. 1994559
File: 1715130225813.mp4 (12.51 MB, 576x1024, ew.mp4)
>>1994234Hon looks exactly like this tiktok troon
No. 1994874
>>1992621>>1992687And you can’t even “separate the art from the artist” with Lovecraft because his writing is infused with his beliefs. He was obsessed with race-mixing and the ‘monsters’ that would result from it.
The fish people from The Shadow over Innsmouth, with their bulging eyes, wide thick-lipped mouths and wide flat noses, are meant to invoke black people. Vile man.
Anyway, the house elves in Harry Potter are as much an allegory for battered housewives as slavery. JKR directly references SPEW (the Society for Promoting the Employment of Women), an early feminist organisation. In my opinion she did a pretty good job capturing the widespread societal apathy towards the oppression and exploitation of women, as well as the patriarchal brainwashing that keeps women complicit in it. It hasn’t escaped me that the people criticising JKR’s depiction of house elves are the same people chanting ‘sex work is work’ and perpetuating the happy hooker myth.
No. 1994998
I can understand that some men prefer to dress in a feminine way. Or they see themselves as so feminine that they're a true and honest woman. They choose a female name and wear female clothes so they can LARP. OK. Fine.
It becomes a problem for me when they bring their LARP into single sex spaces. Especially DV shelters - how entitled do you have to be to demand that traumatised women prioritise YOUR feelings above their very real problems? A woman who has been beaten and raped by a member of YOUR sex, in a phenomenon that all societies have recognised since the beginning of time, and that modern statistics show is an unfortunate reality? Sex is a reality that even transcends species; almost all life on earth has a clear distinction between male and female… and you want us to ignore that so you can roleplay as the woman of your dreams?
I don't want to "genocide" trans people, either. If you have a pathological need to LARP as the opposite sex full time then you need to accept that society will place you in a third category. Your biology is neither male nor female due to the modifications you have made to it. Create your own sports leagues, DV shelters, hospital wards, dating sites etc. No one wants to kill you. You're just butthurt we don't see you as a true and honest woman. Grow up and understand not everyone sees you in the positive light you see yourself. Sex discrimination is necessary to give men and women equal opportunities to succeed in society.
People finding your existence disgusting is something you have to get used to, BTW. Welcome to the experience of every POC or gay person in the world. Since I was old enough to be aware of racism, I have stepped outside with the knowledge that some people in my country wish I hadn't been born. I can't change the color of my skin or my sexuality. But you had to DECIDE to take hormones, get surgery, and live as a woman. You CHOSE to take on an identity that people discriminate against. Welcome to the consequences of your actions!
No. 1995211
File: 1715182070598.png (505.21 KB, 1024x939, kbifU4J.png)
No. 1995246
File: 1715182828990.jpg (561.05 KB, 1080x1665, Screenshot_20240508-173614_X.j…)
Really cool how "life saving care" makes people attempt suicide even more, wow such euphoria, dysphoria cured, another life saved!
I've said it before but if you genuinely hate trans people the absolute best thing you can do to cause them the most amount of harm is too cheer them on and give them what they (think they) want.
No. 1995372
File: 1715185776409.jpeg (515.58 KB, 828x994, IMG_0920.jpeg)
Dead by Daylight tranny that allegedly didn’t know who he was voicing died last week lol
No. 1995397
>>1995372He knew it was a shapeshifting horror creature, he was just mad that it turned out to be ugly. Which monsters usually are.
Was the rare condition he had related to taking hormones?
No. 1995419
File: 1715187535838.jpg (145.52 KB, 558x665, 20240508_115650.jpg)
>>1995409It's called the unknown, a shape shifter that can mimic voices to lure in
victims. The default appearance is basic zombie guy but it also has this skin that got some trannies mad
No. 1995438
>>1995419they claim to be women but no woman gave a shit about this because women know it's caricatural, they really tell on themselves kek
Also I wonder how hormones influenced his "brain swelling"!
No. 1995461
>>1995372Sorry for this joke but
maybe he's just planning on coming back as the zombie from the game
No. 1996299
File: 1715246590604.png (15.33 KB, 104x104, Goal.png)
I go to a gaming bar every Tuesday to play vidya and hang out with friends, on Tuesday they do a Smash Bros tournament. 2 days ago I got to play against the resident TiM, he has unwashed hair with a badly done ponytail, a fat face with a noticeable belly, skinny shirts that make his body more apparent, small facial hair, he wears a pin that says "they/them" but the French version and a rainbow coloured bag. I can only give him credit for not wearing a skirt. To register to this tourney you gotta use a third party site, he has a fucking picrew pfp that is pic related (and yes with that filename), it's very funny.
I'm bad at vidya, I lost and he didn't play unfairly or anything but goddamn, sitting next to that beast was uncomfortable in general. He's always hanging out with a pretty woman that looks like she takes a lot of care of herself, it feels night and day when they're next to each other.
No. 1996705
File: 1715281127692.png (50.54 KB, 611x546, intersex.png)
Imagine grieving for imaginary situations.
No. 1996915
File: 1715290302300.jpg (69.64 KB, 653x395, 1715257193203.jpg)
why is the nazi-to-mtf pipeline so common?
No. 1997062
File: 1715297165352.jpeg (1.27 MB, 1170x1746, IMG_3193.jpeg)
Ends with him implying his mom should transition
No. 1997065
File: 1715297434450.jpeg (1.17 MB, 1170x1794, IMG_3185.jpeg)
Imagine throwing temper tantrums over growing long hair but all of a sudden when it’s associated with men and masculinity it becomes a-ok
The more I come this specific emulation of masculinity the more I find gendered divide absurd (not in a gendie way that’s disgusting)
I also find it with some lesbians, the only reason they present themselves a certain way is because of its association with masculinity but in a world where it was flipped and dresses were considered masculine they would be running around in dresses. Maybe im thinking about it too much
No. 1997069
File: 1715297847344.png (26.91 KB, 970x266, kkk.png)
>>1996915Oh this one's interesting. Doesn't seem like your classic raging homosexual or hyper-manly, authority-obsessed AGP. This looks like he was in desperate need for a new set of values, something that worked better for him than the KKK ideology that isolated him and made him look insane. He had to reevaluate his entire value system as an adult (this usually happens earlier), which made him vulnerable to campus LGBTQIA+ woo. He probably got told 'just be yourself! You're okay as you are' and thought it was the most revolutionary and awesome thing ever.
No. 1997262
From /snow/: TIF claims she called a woman with a "terf bag" a coward and suddenly "cis women" are more dangerous than men.
No. 1997387
File: 1715308234915.png (167.74 KB, 720x1028, IMG_20240509_202828.png)
>>1997262These comments are so retarded
No. 1997433
File: 1715310176382.gif (2.41 MB, 390x277, e8a.gif)
>>1997392>>1997405Besides you can bet $1 that shit would be over tq+ news or pinknews about "a poor trans man was abused by a pharmacist during the day" and many people would have asked to the pharmacist to be fired. I bet she's so ACAB so that's why she didn't report it.
>>1997383"I'll take a photo of a woman against her will and make it about me and my feelings because the tote bag was a
terf one". Of course the consequences are she explaining she's afraid of women for carrying tote bags?
No. 1997468
>>1997459That's weird as fuck. Don't they also claim "not all queer people like to be called queer"? Then why would be '
problematic' that a bi woman don't like to be called 'queer'? You dodged a bullet, nonna.
No. 1997521
File: 1715314176180.jpg (1.1 MB, 2560x1920, IMG_4454-scaled.jpg)
>>1997478>>1997509If that's the case, then that girl wasn't for you. I wouldn't date someone whose only talk is about gender stuff and nothing else. Gimme your ideas about hobbies or interest or about general news or your fav tv show, at least. Besides if it makes you feel you had to walk under egg shells because "anything you say might sound like a
terf would say"?
>>1997515Not mention also they LOVE to make "trans people were from old times" in an era where everything was homophobic, misogynist, pedophile and much more. Why would you want to claim something was "queer" back then when women didn't even have voice to speak about something? They love to grasping at the straws.
No. 1997526
>>1997521Yeah nona I wouldn't date her anyway because like I said I'm in a relationship but part of the reason I went to the party was to try to make more new friends after a spell of being kind of solitary. Except the only new people I met worth talking to were scrotes, the 2 women I met who I got into conversations with both seemed like insane genderists (the other one was worse, but also is straight). I just hate that I go to parties now and feel jumpier around women, especially gay women, because they all seem TRA-aligned. I don't need more moid friends, my 2 careers are STEM and music which are full of moids, but whenever I meet women I initially get along with they say something so genderist I am afraid to talk to them anymore.
Trans people from old times is just a retarded take, especially considering that most historical examples are either marginalized/prostituted gay men or women who hid their biosex because they wanted to do a job or hold a position they were passionate about. In one sense I wish we talked about 'old timey' queer people more so we could just highlight the difference between 'trans' males who were usually some form of prostituted child or degenerate like d'Eon versus 'trans' females who were usually just a normal woman who wanted to be a doctor, sailor, biologist, or in the military.
No. 1997536
>>1997535Haven't intersex people been complaining for decades that troons should stop using them as a talking point? Why won't they stop.
The only legit context in which to bring up 'intersex' people is males in women's sports like the Rio olympics when 3 men won the 800-meter dash. That's a good example of why troon males shouldn't be in women's sports either, otherwise intersex people have like nothing to do with troons.
No. 1997615
>>1997262Flirting with me to upset me?
Calling me dear to upset me?
Sending kisses to upset me?
I couldn't imagine living such a life of professional victimisation that someone drops a X on the end of a sentence and you freak out like that
No. 1997634
>>1997596A pooner used to be a female 4chan user. There was one sperg who came to the boards and said all women are poons (so are "your mom/sis/wife/daughter"), as much as i remember, followed by another moid replying they dont care if their relatives trooned. Brutal.
But for insults such as tranny or troon is rarely thrown around among normies though. Misogyny is brutal nonas.
No. 1997915
>>1997810>>1997814nta but, as a tall woman (6' kek), I do think you can end up living a different 'female experience' to short women. An easy example is that most people can't physically look down on me, and my stature (now that I've gotten over myself and am not insecure about it) can kinda back up my confidence, if that makes sense? I'm either only a couple inches shorter than or eye-level with a few men, and taller than most, so I don't find them particularly intimidating by default. The dumb animal part of people's brains seems to view height as a respectable/authoritative trait, so there's that as well– it's like people see me as more of an 'adult' than my shorter female peers sometimes. It's a bunch of subtle stuff that filters through every interaction, though there's some negatives too, such as being accused of being male (even if your features are otherwise very feminine), people assuming you're being more threatening/intimidating than you are because you're looming, and people do stare (especially if you go from sitting to standing, or travel to Asia or something lol). You also can't get away with 'cutesy' behaviour and mannerisms, it weirds everyone out kek
I got almost no shit (hell, I got encouragement) growing up for being a turbo tomboy in comparison to my short tomboy friends, as if people just didn't expect me to try to look and behave more femininely because that ship had already sailed by being born a giraffe. You also get locked out of a lot of more feminine clothing options, as something advertised as knee-length, for example, can be mid-thigh or higher (depending on brands and styles). Even if you can get everything to work, it's easy to feel like a gigantic clown because you're just literally bigger than most other women and so something that looks cute on a 5'3'' woman looks tacky and desperate on you (or worse, TIM-ish). I'm not saying a tall woman can't be feminine either, just that it can be a bit harder to be forced into the mould when you're too long for it, so they have to be feminine on their own terms rather than trying to match aesthetics geared towards average or petite women.
Sorry for the big anecdotal ramble, but height and its relation to gendie shit interests me because I would have thought more girls like I was growing up would go for it, as ime it's pretty common for tall women to likened to men anyway and with the current rhetoric I could see someone giving up and going troon, but instead it's almost always short women and I just don't get it.
No. 1998043
>>1997915>You also get locked out of a lot of more feminine clothing optionsTall women have their struggles too but I'm sure they're some custom made clothes out there just for them. It's not like they should give up and become ftm just because feminine clothes are not sold their size and built.
>they have to be feminine on their own terms>it's easy to feel like a gigantic clown because you're just literally bigger than most other womenIt feels like finding scraps for not just tall women but women with large shoulders, large "mannish" bodies too. I'd say this applies more to women with more particularly broad shoulders and wider frames than taller women because they were made to feel masculine, and it's only lucky they could be comfortable if they are tomboys to begin with.
>with the current rhetoric I could see someone giving up and going troon, but instead it's almost always short women and I just don't get itWe neither, and people are actually struggling to see how troonism even works. Tall or big women who were made to feel unfeminine or a "tomboy by default" their whole lives they went the troon route thinking it's easier might make more sense.
>>1997810>I'm the older sister with my TIF sister,and it's hilarious she kept repeating why am I treated "more like a guy"Being the oldest sister in an all-girl sibship might have this effect therefore a lot of TiFs tends to be oldest daughters (but loosely compared, as i refer to older sisters of younger brothers) for the opposite reason.
Most of the time older sisters were raised as boys in extreme cases, even persisting after a newborn brother's birth if getting the male privilege is important to some families.
Going troon for women if they have only little brothers are as earlier anon said, a way to restore balance by identifying as trans, going troon for women if they have only younger sisters are like the tall women analogy if you can compare.
No. 1998116
>>1998043>Tall women have their struggles too but I'm sure they're some custom made clothes out there just for them>not like they should give up and become ftm just because feminine clothes are not sold their size and builtThis is true, sorry I didn't mean to imply that, more so that a lot of stereotypically feminine clothing styles or common brands won't have options that fit well (cheap brands also often run short in length because it's cheaper and can be gotten away with for the average customer, and sizing usually assumes and increase in circumference rather than height, so I could for example get something long enough but it's too baggy or expects a larger bust). I dress femininely as well as masculinely, I wasn't trying to imply that women should just give up if they're not catered to, I was more trying to comment on how height can potentially cause you to miss out on some female socialisation because of how others perceive you.
I agree about women who have broader shoulders etc as also having it tough when it comes to clothing and other's judgement of their femininity, especially if they're not interested in tomboyish looks or being butch. A lot of the fashion advice I've seen for those body types/features almost seems intentionally frumpy too, it's unfortunate.
>>1998048I've gotten this from a couple tifs while at uni and they were such little creeps about it kek
No. 1998120
>>1997526I feel exactly the same way. I’m straight but most of my female friends used to be lesbian or bi and/or autistic, and every single one of them turned into a gender proselytiser who thinks you should call a 4-year-old girl ‘they/them’ if she likes cars and dinosaurs. It’s extremely difficult to try and make new female friends when you’re constantly waiting for them to drop the gender bomb on you. I’ve never met another gc woman in real life. They’re all either clueless on the issue (but lean towards ‘being kind’) or they’re hardcore TRAs. It’s very isolating.
>>1997558I think >90% of men who claim to be ‘intersex’ online are lying. Actual men with Klinefelter’s or CAIS or any other DSD aren’t going to be advertising the fact
unless they’re raising awareness and educating, in which case they’ll probably specify which condition they have since there are so many and they present in so many different ways. A man simply calling himself ‘intersex’ is probably fetishising being part-female and likely doesn’t have any DSD at all.
No. 1998199
File: 1715371069660.png (96.81 KB, 725x398, Screenshot 2024-05-10 155722.p…)
>>1998156A lot of anons presume that most tifs troon out to become hot twinks and want to dunk on them when they get male pattern baldness and acne. But it's not the case with a lot of tifs, especially the ones who have history with sexual abuse. I recall a lot of detransitioners stating that the thought that they were ugly as women caused them to troon out in the first place. I also believe people who lement how tifs are wasting their attractiveness by trooning out are not helpful either, maybe they don't like the attention. Either way, i totally agree that basing so much of a woman's worth on how attractive she is a key issue that causes many women to develop dysphoria that may develop into them wanting to become a man. You're not really hurting their feelings by calling them ugly any more than as if a troon was to call a gender critical person a
terf. What's even the point? Tifs have bigger fish to fry in regards to the damage testosterone does to their bodies outside their physical appearance and how prescribing testosterone for women with body dysmorphia is barely different from prescribing crack cocaine to someone with depression considering it's literally an addictive substance.
No. 1998215
File: 1715372010599.jpeg (174.63 KB, 750x750, IMG_0498.jpeg)
eatin a tuna sandw ich, feels good anons
No. 1998220
File: 1715372444563.mp4 (595.72 KB, 270x480, 6BQtHcW.mp4)
I still don't understand why trannies are so obsessed with jerma
No. 1998238
>>1998104I’m disappointed by the obsession to look like a man and cry over having boobs and hips which makes them look more womanly and unable to wear men’s clothing.
I hate seeing it in women’s spaces it breeds such unnecessary insecurity, why is that the ideal butch fashion what happened to “butch is an attitude not just fashion “
No. 1998291
So I'm a merch artist and I feel like I'm the only ""cis"". I swear, every week I have to check the pronouns of my colleagues so I don't accidentally misgender someone and cause a ruckus in the middle of the convention. I'm really tired, it feels like right now it's a requirement and no one can't convince me it's not social contagion. One after another, like bowling pins, in particular my "neighbour" artist started to go by they/them after her bff (also merch artist and fandom artist) started to go by they/them. I cannot risk my source of income right now so I'm a crypto but I wish they could tell me how it makes sense, they're very feminine and often go in alt/lolita coords at cons but they claim to be tifs because being feminine as a tif is somehow breaking the gender norms but the norms are outside, not inside your brain. You break the gender norms when people can see that you do break them. If people call you "she" and you have to correct them, then this empowering move is not working…why? Why can't I enjoy my little autistic fandom corners anymore? Why everything has to go political? Why are every nerd hobbies filled with the most destructive nlog fade? I'm actually sad. To avoid them, 10 years ago, I just had to walk past smelly and sweaty pride parades, now they're infecting everything, because this shit spreads like a disease. I dread for the day that they'll ask my pronouns or kick out my space because yes, if you see this whole phenomenon, both fandom and gender shit became big after 2020. I've been here since the mid to late 2000s and this shit is depressing. Sage for rant but really, this has to stop somewhere. I think it eventually become so boring that everyone will move one and cringe at their past selves but the fact that his fade is entirely political and has laws changing, women's rights being blurred and to be silenced only for asking questions is tiring as shit.
No. 1998297
>>1998222the irony being that a truly good person would never support troons in the first place
>>1998203that rethoric is so retarded, a woman is a woman regardless of the way she looks and i do agree its definitely part of why so many troon out. being a woman shouldnt be so associated with beauty in general when moids get to exist as their ugly selves and are the ones who should be impressing women with their looks
>>1998282no i would do the same
>>1998291so relateable, being in fandoms sucks now because of this shit. it'll definitely disappear at some point and they'll move on to something else eventually but it's taking so long and i hate to think my teenage years and 20s i've had to deal with this shit like why can't it end faster. i'd like to actually be able to enjoy things without this bullshit before i'm like 80 but it just keeps going
No. 1998308
>>1998300I want them to explaim nonbinarism to me. I'm 100% serious and willing to listen to them but of course their reply is "I don't
feel like I belong to a gender or the other!"
So is gender a feeling?
>No gender is a form of expressionSo it's like fashion?
>How fucking dare you, no, it's real!But you can break gender roles as a girl or boy and to break them you have to follow and acknowledge roles to begin with
>Yes but by not identifying as a girl I'm already breaking the gender roles by being feminineBut if no one can
see your identity, then what this is all for?
>Because I'm okay with being seen as feminine but I know I'm not a woman and that makes me feel good.How come you're not a woman?
>Because I don't feel like one.Back to square one, so what makes a woman a woman?
>Feeling like oneHow does a woman feel? Since you don't feel like a woman you must know how a woman feels by saying that you don't feel like them
>Hmm nonna idk, I'm not a woman, I don't know how they feel :/ I seriously thank my autistic brain that despite what this gendies say, forced me to see things from the logical point of view and saved me from this madness otherwise I would be cooked too, but I don't think I'm the only smart one, you feel me? Like I think you have to actually be stupid to buy this shit and yet so many do, I don't think there are so many retarded people or am I being too optimistic?
No. 1998366
>>1997814>Neither could tifsYou're right, not all TiFs are equal for that matter, ie. autistic/butch/masculine women who troon out come off differently. It comes down to trying hard to be cute and non-threatening, being overly non-confrontational (breaking down on tumblr because you got misgendered instead of 'correcting' the boomer like a TiM would), neurotic preoccupation with aesthetics, treating the self as an object etc. An example would be the long comics where TiFs list all the girly things they like and agonize over what it means for their 'gender'. It's not because they like pink or kawiwi things. It's because treating their 'pretty girly tboy emo' brand like it's
extremely meaningful and indicative of who they are (not just their interest) is ironically very feminine. This is especially true for adult TiFs.
They're more susceptible to this if they're short since people take short women less seriously, infantilizing them, and trooning out looks like a way out but it's not a meaningful break from their former position.
>>1997915You explained it so well. Even tall women who look feminine are treated somewhat differently in all-female groups and by guys, feel alienated by the feminine competition, so they don't bother. This is why tall/athletic girls get along well with 'weird' girls, they have this in common.
No. 1998390
>>1998120AYRT and I was lucky enough to terfpill/peak most of my closer female friends. Once your female friends are willing to say GC stuff around other people I've noticed most normie men will happily go along with it because they mostly only virtue signal about troons for social acceptability points from women, unless they're some variety of shitlib/male feminist or have AGP themselves. I did have a couple good friends I basically lost to the queer/TRA lobbying back in the day unfortunately but a lot of my remaining friends are bisexual and not gendies, plus most of the straight girls I know are sick of troons too. I guess I expected it would be easier to make new female friends in those social circles but what was I thinking?
100% agree that almost all men who claim to be intersex online are lying, and that most people with an actual DSD will engage in charity for/talk about that specific DSD not just bring up 'oh I'm intersex too' at random when they're defending their AGP on twitter.
No. 1998392
>>1998199Most of the women who troon out because they're unattractive as women think they will be attractive as men, nona. Knowing a lot of them personally they do want to be attractive twinks and most are very upset that they became ugly and bald once it really hits them. I even talked a friend out of starting testosterone (she had already seen the therapists for the letter and everything) because I just asked her 'do you really want to lose your natural voice, do you really want body hair, do you really want to start balding' and she was like 'oh I never considered those things before, no that would be horrible.' She later admitted she was specifically transitioning to be more attractive 'as a man' to straight/bi women.
While yes some women do intentionally make themselves look ugly because of trauma, most don't want to look ugly and don't like looking ugly, they just want to look male (which in their eyes is not the same thing as ugly). Testosterone does much worse things to the body than making women ugly but in my experience no one cares or thinks about chronic illness for real until it's personally affected them, while the thought of becoming (even more?) ugly really does terrify most women, even GNC and traumatized women .
No. 1998449
File: 1715390739907.jpg (17.29 KB, 300x300, ab67656300005f1fb24e61585e2951…)
Maintenance Phase is a podcast I listen to often but their recent episode is on "rapid onset gender dysphoria" and it's…..so bad. I don't know why TRAs who are so intelligent and well researched in other areas let it fall apart the second it comes to troons. I'm about half way through and they've mentioned a lot of their info for this episode comes from Julia "getting fucked is what female is" Serrano, yikes.
No. 1998636
>>1998610So kf is the most feminine site known to man? Give me a break
nonnie, men gossip just as much
No. 1998722
>>1997262Xe has the mannerism of a faggot and the looks of a reddit moderator that jerks off to lolicon.
Xillion must die.
No. 1999102
File: 1715455769825.jpg (30.79 KB, 600x439, 30shoes.jpg)
>>1998639kek that retarded anon doesn't know that even LC was made by a man. Kf was also made by a man and is fucking FULL of them.
No. 1999759
>>1999432No one in my immediate area was a troon. It's an Asian country tbh.
>>1999707Their daughters. E.g. having aunts discussing about what to prepare their 12-15 y/o daughters for puberty where I got to witness the actual change of female bodies maturing contrary to the expectations of porny depictions of women on the internet.
I am same-sex attracted, bordering to SSOA so it did a number on my psyche.
No. 1999786
>>1999781So if I'm understanding correctly you are still identifying as a troon? Even now that you know it is because you are same sex attracted? Why?
>>1999784Even relatively good parents and relatives will make these weird comments about their children, my mom was supportive of my gender nonconformity as a child but she used to make comments when I was like literally 7-9 years old about how I had a 'curvy womanly figure' and would grow up looking better than other girls because I was 'curvy,' my mom herself was this extremely shy and tomboyish woman who never dated other than my dad and I can only assume it was some weird thing of living vicariously through me but it traumatized me and made me extremely self-conscious about hitting puberty and developing. I don't think my mom is a pedo at all and I never felt creeped out in that way but when I was older/in my teens she would try to 'peek' at my boobs when I was changing and when I said it made me uncomfortable she said she just 'wanted to see because she never had big ones herself' and then started calling my boobs saggy. She's the type of person who's horrified by the grooming in schools and whatever and would never support pedoshit getting into schools but she still felt the need to project all this weird sexual stuff on me at an extremely young age, she also constantly 'accused' (idk what word to use here) me of having been predated upon by older men when I was a child, like she had a theory I was raped by a camp counsellor or that one of my middle school teachers was a pedo groomer and something 'happened' between us. I don't even think women from conservative cultures realize they're creepy when they do this and I don't think they see it as sexualizing their daughters.
No. 1999794
>>1999791Not really, it's in a way being coincidentially same-sex attracted though it can influence the direction of trooning out. Yes, I identify as a TiF. Discovered this thread from google, in case my opinions are not welcome. There seems to be a no-male rule just by scrolling from the top of the thread alone so I'm in quite a grey area here.
>>1999784>>1999789>>1999788>>1999786>>1999791What mattered was some parents unfortunately fail to understand how receptive and malleable children's minds are to sensitive topics such as sexual wellbeing and adapting to pubertal changes, including extreme discomfort like when moms keep checking on their daughters growth it makes the daughters feel both vulnerable and infantilized, as if she's being creeped on in some level.
Being told about sexual exploration as teens (as a SSA/SSOA) feels so goddamn infantilizing, like it's a whole different level of being predated on. As if lesbians are predatory ffs. Kinda want a different opinion on this from bi women and lesbians, as well as straight women here.
No. 1999798
>>1999794Yeah you're not male so you're probably welcome but this imageboard is pretty hostile to people who believe in gender ideology, personally I don't mind but if you decided to troon out based on the reasons you outlined it seems like you are pretty clear-headed about knowing you're female, I guess I don't understand why you still choose to identify as a TIF instead of just accepting that you are same-sex attracted and hate misogynistic norms for women? Are you planning on getting hormones and surgeries or is it just a self-ID thing? What do you get out of identifying as male when you know you're female and can't escape female socialization?
Can you specify what you mean with the second half of your post, I'm unclear on what you're asking for an opinion on. Like are you asking how being told about sex for adults affects SSA/straight women in general or what adults say about gay and straight women?
>>1999793I can't disagree with the perverted part but I wouldn't call it predatory because I don't know what she really personally got out of acting like this. I think my mom acted 'perverted' because she was actually extremely innocent and shy around sex and her body but was predated upon by other people, and tried to live through me vicariously and confide in me in a weird way about her own hangups. Ironically she would probably consider herself really prudish and clean-minded but I think she has extreme fixations and hangups on sex, sexuality and looks because she herself was a
victim.
No. 1999808
>>1999798E.g. parent's view of sexual expression in teens hits differently for someone like me, like it's so creepy as well in a comparable way to be told by your respective moms about breast development, it's nothing like glamorizing leslarpers or spicy straight kweer girls in mainstream media. It's more on we're near the bottom of the totem pole and getting reminded that our attraction to women and sexual behaviors/predispositions makes us a
valid excuse to be shit on mainly because we don't look like a queer on tv and am not hypersexual enough, supposedly. What I (personally got) end up feeling is being infantilized and being crepeed on like how pushy moms would their daughter. It makes me go nlog on top of going troon when i found out many girls are in a similar position.
>seems like you are pretty clear-headed about knowing you're femaleThere's some kind of knee-jerk allergy that causes me to be disturbed by being referred to as a female irl, it's that I HAVE to be this clear-headed every time to suppress this response. Yes, I would go the buck angel route with a bottom surgery.
No. 1999813
>>1999794This is really quite interesting, is this the first thread you've seen? In any case, I think you're welcome to lurk and comment as you please as long as you read the room properly, although as the other anon said you might be met with hostility in a lot of cases especially you announce you're a TIF (do not announce it in the /snow/ threads at all, you'll get a ban). I'd recommend you give the rules a good read just in case you miss anything, although so far you seem like a reasonable newfag and troon which is refreshing to see for once.
Also, out of curiosity what are your general thoughts and feelings about the general TIPs and TRAs online? Or do you not interact with them at all?
No. 1999822
>>1999813First thread.
I've never came across another TiP irl. Online tho, I usually interact on case by case basis.
For TRAs it's about discerning their reasoning and where it comes from, I won't directly argue with a TRA except in the scenario I am forced into a debate session. If there's any concern, it's about how children and teens are vulnerable to being groomed to becoming troon.
Though, what can't be found on the internet is actually HOW these kids could transform their beliefs overnight that they suddenly believe they're no longer the sex they are born with and deserve troon surgery.
No. 1999826
>>1999823Yeah where I live too you can pick up prescriptions on someone else's behalf. And if they think the person is trying to scam them they call your phone number to make sure you approve of them picking it up, they don't grope whoever is picking it up. Everything about this story is extremely fake sounding and as with many troon fictions sounds like the invention of someone who has not left their own bedroom in 6+ months.
>>1999822So do you believe you were groomed as a child since you started identifying as a TIF at 11 or do you think you were not subject to any online grooming? What are the points on which you agree/disagree with TRA ideology?
No. 1999834
>>1999826Before trans ideology was big. I wasn't groomed as a child afaik, my parents were super against it.
I went on estrogen blockers first then T. I don't believe trooning out is for
anyone, as there are already some stories of men being convinced by gatekeeping doctors they should not troon because they are AGP;plus their physical appearance and psyche (psyche is a big factor actually. they have to be mutationally delusional enough to be flawless troon in my opinion idk if its the right word kek) gave them no chance of passing.
The one video on tiktok with "top surgery is for everyone" pissed me off, as it's not even about trans ideology amymore. It negates my lived experience in a way (kek), with me jealously guarding myself from being mogged and outdone by my sister and female cousins. It makes me feel like my life is on cheating conmode.
No. 1999850
>>1999843>you avoided them being compared to you as prettier or more feminine?Good point. Before I trooned out I might not care about these, and it's that there is a layer of misogyny as although I haven't been in direct contact with trans people, my dad is surrounded by TiMs (read:the average r/asktransgender mtf based on how he describes them) every now and then due to business trips in USA. He explains how I'm not like them at all therefore I'll regret my decision. It's heavily linked to why I don't want to be feminine or else it's "proof I have no reason to go troon".
I actually would want my female relatives to be more feminine than me, it's like a feeling I don't doubt myself.
No. 1999871
What happened to telling attention seeking trannies to fuck off, nonas? There's nothing to be discussed here that hasn't been covered ad nauseam elsewhere on the site. TIFchan, if you're reading this what you're doing is known as "avatarfagging", posting in a way that identifies yourself. I'm not gonna report you for it 'cause you're new here, but it's against the rules. If you wanna integrate and post anonymously, then fair enough, but save the AMAs for reddit. I don't like having trannies here personally. As a butch lesbian who's came close to trooning out in moments of weakness, quite frankly I view your kind as crabs in a bucket that should be kept far away from GNC women. But I can't hate you completely because, reluctantly, I do get it. I wish you well, I hope you knock it off with the justifications and come to accept yourself as a woman.
No. 1999884
>>1999877Thanks. Also, I go to a completely different uni and was going to report it to his uni through the anonymous complaint form, but IDK if people even look at those forms.
I’ve never submitted anything to the news. Would you send it to an outlet or a specific reporter or what? Would I have more luck choosing a reporter who has written about trans pervert teachers before?
No. 1999886
>>1999871I initially responded to her AMA because I thought she was a detrans woman but I wanted to gently question her because it seems like she is close to peaking on a lot of TRA ideology and seems to come from a very conservative culture. But then I just became very confused.
>>1999874My first thought was to report it too but the university won't do anything. I agree with your idea and the other anon that you should report it to some news outlet, preferably not a very leftist one but one that has reported on trans/feminist issues before. There are some outlets like Reduxx that are not right-wing but also don't get much attention, so you could try both one of those and some more mainstream local right-wing ones. But report it anonymously using protonmail or something.
No. 1999894
>>1999884I honestly have no idea how to choose an outlet. I would just look for publications and reporters that have done similar articles about pervert troons in the past. I agree with
>>1999886 not to send it to a leftist one, that'll be like pissing in the wind. Maybe try asking over on /2X/ if anyone has recommendations on where to report it? They usually have good sources for anything that's came up in the news recently, so you might get pointed in the right direction by them.
No. 1999902
>>1999871Nona, don't. Stay away from the crabs in a bucket. We feel for you.
Trooning out in moments of weakness is what the TRAs and TiPs take advantage of.
No. 2000097
File: 1715521906499.jpg (34.19 KB, 565x694, 442418657_846118064223131_5080…)
A perfect gendie winner for the most political event I see, not surprised.
I hate how genderism is so superficial, fuck europe (rightfully so) for not kicking out israel but kicking out russia but suddenly europe good for lettng a gendie win, their morals are so shallow and performative it disgusts me. I'm far for screaming "#FreePalestine" because I do not fucking care what those two shitholes do, and yes, killing children is bad and that's basic common sense, but I still get amazed that their morals get thrown under the bus when it's time to feed their ideology, it stands higher than everything. It stands higher over life, family, health, values. Sick.
No. 2000113
>>2000105Italian
nonny here, we don't have the third neutral gender in our language and all our pronouns are gendered even in plurals so there are basically no vowels left, the press is using male pronouns because despite the gendies trying to push the butchering of our language (with shit like Lui (him), Lei (her), L*i (??? the fuck is this how do you pronounce this), they are forced to use professional speaking and ofc gendie lingo is not professional. The only way around could be using the plural (which is also gendered) but that won't reflect the reality because he isn't two people so kek. The jobless gendies are still asleep but I can't wait to see some seething and coping here and there.
Just imagine, for your own fetish or nlopism, fucking up an entire language and yet it doesn't work so why bother
No. 2000366
>>2000274My old workplace was full of edgelord scrotes who were openly racist, misogynistic, antisemitic, ableist etc. but would defend (male) troons to the death. Holocaust, lynching and rape jokes were all in good fun but calling a man in striped socks a man? That’s not on! You’ll hurt his feelings!! Male TRAs are just MRAs in rainbow t-shirts.
>They think calling a man a man is a punishment or only something certain troons deserveI disagree. I think they think that calling a man a woman is a punishment for being insufficiently manly, and that calling someone like Keffals or Blaire men devalues manhood. They still value them over actual women because they recognise that they’re males, but they don’t want to have to share a category with them either.
No. 2000677
>>2000663I have to theory but I'm afraid to pass as some kind of schizo that flamboyant faggots have a biological component. I always thought that they were the result of first world more inclusive societies but every culture has its faggots so I guess that the male fetus, being a failed female embryo, has some kind of mutation in faggots but I don't see butches acting like men (unless they're ultra one-of-the-boys pickmes). They way faggots act it's very stereotypical and also their voices are higher so unless all of them commonly agreed to sound higher, it's a natural trait that they have. Higher/softer voice, weird mannerism and promiscuity. All of men with weird high voices are faggots or some kind of homo leaning bisexuals while women that are more "masculine" are not butches.
Sage for derailing but ofc in faggots I include hsts so I can see why they try to pull the biology bullshit and while it's not totally wrong, it doesn't make them women because women don't act like faggots. Not one of them. Even the most vain bimbo I know doesn't act as obnoxiously as a faggot so they're the own "gender" if we're talking in that way but that puts them in their own category of failed men or men trapped in men's body, not an egg or a woman at all.
No. 2000694
>>2000097>on the largest european tv show>still wearing a polyster skater skirt that looks like it's straight from amazonmoid behavior
i don't understand why the jury was bending over backwards to applaud this superrrr speshullll gendie when we've had a participant like Conchita Wurst who is arguably much more gender non-conforming and doesn't delude others into calling him a woman or ~nonbinary~
No. 2000718
>>2000694it's not moid behaviour, nona, it's cosplay.
troons wear cosplay, they don't wear "clothes." if you carefully look at the majority of them they have the same amazon skirt and socks, same aliexpress chokers and so on, like cosplayers who buy their costumes on those chinese sites. They don't shop for clothes, they look at the typical troon attire and wear that. No woman dresses like them.
No. 2000871
Went to the park with a new coworker and met with some people, a group of about 6 others that she kind of knew. We were sitting there eating and someone said we should go around in a circle and introduce ourselves. First to go was a moid who said "My name is Mark, he/him." Second one, my coworker, "My name is Sarah, she/her." I was next. Said my name, but the pronouns felt so unnatural that there was this extremely uncomfortable, way too long pause. Finally I just said, "My pronouns are she and her, I guess, because of being a woman and all that, if we're really doing the pronoun thing right now …"
I really wanted to leave and probably should have? Everyone was late 20s - early 30s btw. I just couldn't believe regular people would ever opt to do that outside of a classroom or a supervised corporate team-building activity.
No. 2001048
>>2000995Moids have
one less opportunity to be immune to X-linked disorders like colorblindness, they kinda need other factors such as chimerism or retinal transplant (kek, but the sympathy is on those with vision loss and need this surgery).
No. 2001595
File: 1715631094007.jpg (266.46 KB, 1080x1627, 5835cbc1305309a694c20431df894e…)
Kek
No. 2001598
>>2000103Feminism and gay rights are never going to be promoted by Islam period regardless how wealthy and peaceful the country is, and I think it's embarrassing in general for genderists to try to associate with conservative patriarchal religions. The troons visiting the Vatican recently was almost equally cringe although the Pope does seem to be caving to gender ideology, I don't think most actual 'traditional' or devoted Catholics ever will.
>>2000105It's always been really amusing to think about how pronouns and gender language would translate to my native language because almost everything you say, including in the first person or second person, is gendered, and there's also a third neutral gender that's mostly for inanimate objects. So if people wanted to use the pre-existing third gender pronouns they would basically be referring to themselves/others as inanimate objects (There isn't a first/second person version of the neuter version of language though) and if they are trans they would have to change the way they talk about themselves or ask people to refer to them directly as the wrong sex, which would probably expose all those types of troons who post on reddit saying they secretly misgender themselves in their heads all the time. After spending your whole life using male language for yourself it would probably be really tough to make the switch. You'd also sound like a child because a lot of small children in my native language will get it mixed up and accidentally refer to themselves or others as the wrong gender when using verbs for example (e.g. in my language there are two different versions of 'I went' or 'you ate' for male and female speakers).
No. 2001627
>>2000677I'm not sure where I stand on the nature/nurture component of homosexuality and there's no really strong or conclusive evidence for either but it is not unlikely at all that gay men in many cultures just 'agreed' to sound higher. A lot of the time both troons and regular gay men who talk in that high pitched effeminate way will drop their voice down to a normal threatening low male voice when, for example, they get really angry or are threatening a woman. Just because they didn't all sign a contract to behave this way doesn't mean they don't subconsciously or consciously do it on purpose as a social cue or form of social conformity with other effeminate men. Same with stuff people sometimes cite as signs of 'natural' femininity in men like doing more hand-talking and body language things - I think it is a choice, but a choice that is mostly made because they are (badly) aping common traits in women. They never actually look or sound like actual women when doing these things, so I think it is their version of signaling to each other that they are 'feminine.' Women can't drop their voices that low unless they have naturally low voices but every man can go into a falsetto so they do it when they're trying to ape women. Not sure if it is conscious or not in all of them but it doesn't have to be biological or due to any kind of epigenetics. None of this proves that the 'biology bullshit' isn't wrong.
>>2000871Don't let yourself get pressured into doing the pronoun shit nonna, especially if no one was explicitly asking you to. There might have been other women (or men) there who felt pressured like you did but because of you caving they might have felt more pressured/alone there too. There is always a cost both to yourself and others of going along with TRA bullshit.
>>2001230The troon who dropped into the thread said she found it on google but it seems like lolcow got posted or mentioned a few times on tiktok and elsewhere recently.
No. 2001630
File: 1715633184550.jpeg (174.04 KB, 457x394, IMG_0555.jpeg)
>>2000274They keep calling picrel a real woman when those huge joosie male clavicles are extremely clockable. They don’t know what a real woman is because almost none of them have normal relationships with a woman to begin with
No. 2001690
File: 1715635274267.jpg (27.73 KB, 480x360, hqdefault.jpg)
>>1998449man, i love this show but hate when they talk about trans shit. michael and aubrey are unfortunately tranny dicksuckers and the most annoying thing besides looking at data we really can't make any conclusions about yet, the way they talk about detrans people always feels shitty. it's very "yes detransitioners exist BUT they are such a minority they basically don't count". trans people are already a fucking minority too, do they not count????? i wish they'd stick solely to health and wellness because this is not their wheelhouse. if you want a left-leaning podcast that's also gender critical try picrel.
No. 2001739
>>1998511Plenty of brilliant people get roped into cults, and gender ideology is the greatest cult of our time.
It's the same as religion, but I won't go into that here. Basically there are 100 reasons why someone might be convinced to join a cult, and once they're in, it's VERY hard to convince them the cult is wrong. Especially when every online forum, and method of communicating with them, is moderated by the same cultists that you're warning them against.
No. 2001762
Some other decent GC podcasts are Wandering Womb and Women Talking About Their Lives (recently did a good interview with The Buttress and has a good interview with some detransitioners). Maybe Stone Butch Disco if you're starved for lesbian specific content (host comes across as mildly queer and extremely academia poisoned, but occasionally has GC guests. I think she's interesting to listen to because she talks in a way that won't automatically scare off TIFs/libfems the way openly GC content does.).
>>2001690Is Blocked and Reported fully gender critical now? I listened to them a bit when they first started but I found they kind of handled trans stuff with kid's gloves and tried to seem more elevated than the big meanie TERFs. I think I remember ragequitting because in one episode Herzog was like "weh MTFs shitting up the lesbian community aren't even a problem so who cares.". It's been so long since I listened though that maybe I'm mixing them up with another podcast. Sorry Katie Herzog if I'm accidentally accusing you of being pro-AGP.
No. 2002074
File: 1715656383062.jpeg (804.59 KB, 1290x1165, IMG_0808.jpeg)
No. 2002261
>>2002074said this in other thread but copying it to here:
Swede here and that's not accurate. If you ask someone "do you support LGBT rights?" they'd very likely say yes, but if you asked something basic woke as "do you think non-binary is real?" they don't agree unless they're a basement dweller woke terminally online autist, and most people likely still haven't even heard of it. My mom still legit thinks troons are just drag queens and calls them he/him without anyone batting an eye, and she thinks they're glam and fun to watch on tv so she "supports" them. I've still not seen a single local troon who uses our gender neutral pronoun in Sweden. In fact gendies here exclusively go by they/she/he online in English speaking social media, never in Swedish, and I go to fucking anime weeb conventions so I've seen a ton of them kek
And adding here that I fully think it has the same flaw as in English, where people think "transwomen" means "women who identify as trans men"
No. 2002795
File: 1715719119847.jpg (540.48 KB, 1440x1080, enby.jpg)
No. 2002835
File: 1715720505185.mp4 (10.34 MB, 576x1024, c7340da84aef827eb5b656f4af5b97…)
The leftists are so conservative, they literally cannot fathom clothes=/=sex. Literally dresses are for girls, pants are for boys. Oh so progressive. Horse shoe theory is real.
No. 2002854
File: 1715721137757.png (1.31 MB, 1090x1062, to the cis.png)
Saw this in a manga I read once. Made me kek when I thought that some tif or tim might genuinely get triggered over this.
No. 2002860
>>2002074Don't TIMs have
more rights than the average woman? They get state funded butchery while women in a lot of places can't get abortions or even C sections. Also what a awful fucking question, what if someone were to think transwomen aren't women but believe that everyone should have equal rights or vice versa?
No. 2002890
>>2002835They’re so braindead they don’t even get their own ideology or why people are dumbfounded by the current iteration of their movement.
“How can you be against it when you dress up as a woman??” Isn’t a contradiction if anything given their ideology it’s the most rational response
No. 2002903
>>2002893A former dev who worked on the game has all but come out saying it's a purposeful exclusion by ConcernedApe. He claimed it would be an easy addition, even though other devs and modders have claimed otherwise. He has also made a few other politically-charged comments about ConcernedApe.
CA is also supposedly a 4chan native, so I think there's a decent possibility he won't address it. There is already a widely-available mod that turns the game gender neutral, so I'm not sure why people absolutely insist upon it being a part of the vanilla game.
No. 2002965
File: 1715727407861.jpg (2.66 MB, 1500x8000, Podunkian Pronouns.jpg)
>>2002918Yes! His handle on Twitter is @MrPodunkian. Go to his replies and scroll back to the end of March. This is when he mostly started to air all his dirty laundry, including some inconclusive screenshots, accusations that ConcernedApe attempted to "troll" him from a burner account, and a few accusations relating to CA's politics. Worth mentioning - he's currently working on a game that many are criticizing as being a Stardew Valley clone. The game is slated to be released soon, so it's hard not to feel like this is him attempting to shill his game. I've included a screencap of him more recently discussing the "pronouns" situation. He made a comment replying to someone as recently as yesterday claiming the linguistic localization are not the reason CA refuses to include gender neutral options.
>>2002925He definitely was a dev, but the amount of work he put into the game is up for debate. He's credited as Arthur Lee or Mr. Podunkian depending on the version of the game (which apparently was a source of anger for him and his justification for wanting to go public with his distaste for CA, as his "Mr. Podunkian" nickname was excluded in the 1.6 credits update and Arthur Lee was used instead.)
No. 2003022
>>2003000It's a huge bummer and I feel so horribly for the creator. Every time he tweets about a game he put his whole heart and soul into he gets lambasted with a ton of "uuh are you going to comment on the fact you are causing TRANS PEOPLE BEING HARASSED!?" comments. Searching "ConcernedApe pronouns" on twitter also returns a ton of really aggressive, demanding tweets.
>>2003007This is how I feel too. Not to mention - I've played plenty of games where I play as a man, and I've never once felt like I NEED to play as my gender. So why do these people HAVE to play as a non-binary person? It just puts such a bad taste in my mouth how much some people feel everything should be tailored to comfort their specific sensibilities.
No. 2003081
File: 1715736258046.png (367.26 KB, 800x1000, Podunkian Politics.png)
>>2002965I've included an additional screenshot of the disgruntled former dev making some unsubstantiated claims about the various politics of ConcernedApe and his (CA's) girlfriend. In another tweet, he also claimed CA was "sympathetic" towards Scott Cawthon (creator of FNAF) when information about his political leanings was publicly exposed.
>>2003049Not even just that - the game allows you to change your name and gender at-will once your raise your friendship to a certain level with the Wizard for 500 in-game gold (which is an incredibly small amount once you've put any amount of time into the game). If you truly feel so ~fluid,~ simply change your gender! But that's a lot less fun than blaming all your problems on some guy who made a game.
No. 2003301
File: 1715757101084.png (60.38 KB, 707x472, tif.PNG)
I also love when they do this, because I find it fucking hilarious. It's so damn unsubtle. Imagine being so unconvincing even when your whole life is a performance.
No. 2003302
>>2002861Kek I want a cis rocks shirt just to see their reaction. Like why would celebrating your
own identity, that the tranny folk themselves forced upon us, be bullying the trans? They said we're "cis", so why couldn't we embrace it then.
No. 2003317
File: 1715757992730.jpg (51.98 KB, 640x384, cring.jpg)
>>2003308It's from an "ftm hypno" blog so yes.
As for these lame "forcemasc" images, you can just tell they're trying to replicate the skin-crawling nature of sissy shit but it's in this retarded wattpad writing style. It's trying to scare the terbs or whatever but it just makes me roll my eyes.
No. 2003453
File: 1715766026352.webp (135.57 KB, 1985x1123, IMG_5271.webp)
i hate how all gendie activists act like they’ve gone to literal war over TWanZ rIgHTS like the same bitches that can’t order what they want at wing stop and have a breakdown over pronouns think they’re “on the frontlines” like how delusional can you be to think you’re “freedom fighters” and life is SO HARD for the non bineys!!!! and WHY for the love of christ do these freaks always cape so hard for islam?? literal clown world. i hate all of them but this bitch is particularly narcissistic and cringe and legit makes me want to alog. annoyingly i actually liked her song but she as a person and her ugly loser moid are unbelievably objectionable
No. 2003764
>>1998449I've noticed this with people in general, they might seem nice and smart at first about several topics but you get to the troon topic and it's like their brain just shuts off entirely. even when I didn't know as much about trannies as I do now (before I peaked etc) I still didn't make my brain turn off at the mere mention of it so it's always bizarre to me. It feels similar to how you can meet smart people but they also believe in religion / go full retard the second it's questioned
>>2000105They're actively trying to make up new words so it can fit gendie ideology and it always just sounds retarded. I hate how Europe gets shit from the US late so it's like, where I live this shit is starting to pick up now whereas in the US I see more people peaking online. It makes me feel like I'm living in two different timelines
>>2002866Never heard of this but it sounds like a nightmare to be a popular gamedev and have these retards bother you with their bullshit and actively try to pressure you to make your own game worse
No. 2003883
File: 1715787552216.jpg (102.46 KB, 634x734, 2F478D2000000578-3356084-image…)
>>2003801nta but you said it nicely. That's how i always knew right away these "intelligent" people were actually retards - virtue signalling at any opportunity they can get while at the same time being terrible in their real lives. Nobody normal and good hearted needs to virtue signall. Actually smart person knows some social points don't matter.
For example my cousin's pedo boyfriend and eventually my cousin as well. On any topic he must lecture you how you're evil and he is correct, how you're manipulated by nazis or something, how we all should be nice to eachother, polite and respect everyone.. he doesn't forget to mention he studies on several universities and does a very complicated bigbrain job… while he's manipulating little girls to troon themselves because "i love you but i can't imagine myself spending the rest of my life with a girl" or grooming 14 yearold boys into a fat fetish and funny things like that. God i hate TRAs.. Motherfucker even corrected people to use the pronouns of the famous troon Stephonknee because "we mut respect her gender".
No. 2004008
>>2003985I can't believe he people who want little girls to troon out if they like sports and not makeup or that PCOS makes women intersex because they're ugly want to impose the idea it's actually terfs who have narrow views of women kek. In fact it's usually evil terfs reminding women they're still
valid as women regardless of hobbies, features, etc.
No. 2004304
>>2002965kek this game literally lets you:
1) marry any of the romance options regardless of gender (iirc there's even some dialogue specific to same-sex relationships, for example (spoilers)
alex's grandpa is kind of homophobic and several romance options nervously admit they didn't expect to be attracted to someone of the same sex so homosexuality isn't just an option, it's also acknowledged;
2) befriend a wizard in the woods and magically change your sex for pocket change without anyone noticing.
how the fuck do they find things to be mad about in a cozy farming simulator? there's already a mod for pronouns, just install it and fuck off (unless they're playing on ios or switch which is just… why)
if CA really doesn't add gendie shit to the game on purpose that's very based of him
No. 2004431
File: 1715800709318.jpg (13.38 KB, 278x245, 20240515_130224.jpg)
Something I've noticed is that in my class there's one aiden that gets along nicely with everyone, but sometimes I see her friends say stuff like "he's the man!", "you're a very strong man", "he really is victorious!" (cuz her troon name is Victor so they do a pun like that). I didn't think much of it at first but now I think this is just them trying to convince themselves that this girl with short hair is actually a man. She doesn't seem to mind the comments, she chuckles about them. They just feel so forced to me.
No. 2004877
File: 1715831723161.png (1.53 MB, 1080x1286, Screenshot_20240515-205334_(1)…)
The amount of TIMs who used to be in the military is kinda terrifying. They probably raped children and women overseas before trooning out.
No. 2005218
>>2004881>>2005119rape is a massive issue among military moids. they are incapable of restraining their disgusting violent urges so when there are no women around they prey on weaker men just like they do in prison environments. officials either cover it up or the
victims don't report it all because they are ashamed or fear retaliation. i've also heard horror stories of men bringing civilian women and girls onto bases and setting them up to be raped. many mothers who have served in the military would never encourage their daughters to join because they know exactly how she would be treated.
No. 2006315
i really hope this is the right thread for this because i need help. my brother is a mentally ill retard who fell into tra shit so hard that he decided he was mtf and came out to our family over the fucking phone.
no one but my sister (who has stopped speaking to me entirely) is okay with any of this shit.
a little less than a year ago, he came by my house to visit, and i found out that he was spending his rent money on hrt from folx or whatever. he had been asking my mom to supplement rent. he’s morbidly obese, mentally ill, delusional, has a tbi, and is at an increased risk of dvt due to a hereditary vein malformation. they still prescribed him estrogen and finasteride after a single online visit, because that’s apparently legal and ethical.
upon finding his shit, i told my mom, who sat him down and explained that this was a complete and utter violation of her trust. my mom has cried every single fucking day since he decided to “come out” as a goddamn transbian of all things. she told him he was not allowed to buy hrt anymore, and needed to take his psychiatric meds and get into therapy instead. he refuses. he can’t go back to the psychiatrist my family has been with for 10 years because she refuses to take patients on cross-sex hormone therapy due to lack of research on how it can interact with psychiatric meds.
i found his reddit today, and a few months ago, he was celebrating 1.5 years on hrt. he has not stopped. he’s still asking my mom for rent money; bleeding us dry. he’s on academic probation and is not allowed to attend his uni right now. he can’t come home to live with my mom and me so that we can monitor him due to a recent lease he signed. that might be a good thing considering some things i’ve personally tried to bury in the recesses of my mind, like catching him staring at my breasts while i tired to talk to him at the breakfast table; knowing that he stole my mom’s bra when he was a teenager.
i hate this shit so fucking much. i’ve tried to hold on hope. i peaked very recently and i don’t know what i believe anymore. i’m hesitant to call my little brother a pervert. i don’t think he’s bad at heart, but i think he’s a man with some sort of agp that has no respect for the only women in his life who care about his health. my father lost his first son, and he told my mom that he can’t lose my brother because he’s the only son he has left. apparently it’s best to harm your entire fucking family so you can “live your truth” or whatever the fuck. he was such a normal child. i don’t understand what the fuck happened. i don’t know how to tell my mom that i looked him up on reddit of all places and found out he’s still on cross-sex hrt instead of his fucking antipsychotics. i can’t keep watching her cry. why is that shit so fucking easy to access? what the hell do i do, and how do i continue to live my life? how the fuck did my brother become a raging misogynist? there are very few people i can talk to about this. i’m so lost.
tdlr: my little brother is a mentally ill agp who is lying to my family about taking hrt and taking money from my mother in the process, because apparently it’s better to indulge yourself in a delusion than to actually get help for your psychiatric issues, and god forbid anyone speak out against it. fucking kill me.
No. 2006316
File: 1715948709443.jpg (173.17 KB, 828x1143, FW4ph1_UIAAtJ0r.jpg)
While I think most trans supporters are just well-meaning liberals, I believe the overly enthusiastic "anti-TERFs" are undoubtedly sex pests and perverts
No. 2006333
>>2006315I’m so sorry your family is going through this. He’s a selfish narcissist who gets off on causing the women around him pain. Please convince your mom to cut him off financially, at least, if not all together. He doesn’t deserve any of her support. Does she know much about these men? Would showing her some peaking material help get her angry so that she cuts him off? I’d definitely show her the Reddit account, too. Wishing you all the best,
nonnie, and keeping you and your mom in my thoughts.
No. 2006337
>>2006316I know one gay man who's a
terf hater, he cannot just stfu and always has to pitch in when trannies are talked about like he's got a notification for the word "trans" or something…. like anybody cares about his opinion and I can confirm that he's a pedo who orders childsized fuckdolls from abroad.
They defend trannies so much because they know very well that trannies are also in most cases pedo or zoofiles too, it's like they can sence the dark vibe and want to protect member of their dark species.
No. 2006349
>>2006315jesus fucking christ
nonnie, i am so sorry your brother is putting you through all of this shit. i agree with
>>2006333, if he wants to fuck himself up, let him do it with his own money. he may be severely mentally ill, but that isn't an excuse for misogyny or the perverted shit he did to you and your mom. these types of men (overweight, brain damaged, mentally ill) are at a higher risk for trooning out, likely due to not fitting in with other men and wanting a community (that doesn't include women as anything but sex objects because, of course, women are subhuman). on one hand, it's easy to feel pity for him due to his mental state, but on the other there is likely not much you could have done to help him or much you can do now except distance yourself from him so he doesn't drag you down into despair. ceasing contact with a family member is fucking hard and painful, but staying in contact with them while they ruin themselves and you as well is even worse.
put yourself and your mother first
nonnie, you deserve it.
No. 2006491
File: 1715961097159.png (43.15 KB, 799x321, trans allies.png)
>>2006316This post on Ovarit nailed it i think. It's funny because it applies to both gay moids and weak tranny chasers
No. 2006899
File: 1715980532609.png (466 KB, 676x2709, cope.png)
massive kek at calling serano a biologist
No. 2006909
File: 1715980856555.png (81.91 KB, 675x698, kys!.png)
>>2006899samefag, the same specimen i found this post from also reblogged a post making fun of a woman who's paranoid about her safety while home alone, picrel are some of the comments
https://www.tumblr.com/plushiedoggy/750737537679638528 No. 2007047
>>2006385i think you're right. the most loudest
terf hater i knew was a pornsick misogynist who suddenly became loud twitter-leftist TRA overnight in 2015
No. 2007415
File: 1716010312146.png (342.31 KB, 512x477, 1000016794.png)
Oh my god. This happened a month or so ago but in case this wasn't already talked about, get this: Dead by Daylight created a new killer called The Unknown, which seems to be a shape-shifting creature that mimics human voices and appearances to lure in victims. Now, this character was played by a tranny, specifically a TIM. But Dead by Daylight released a skin where the Unknown is dressed up like a woman, and is basically like a monster in a skirt. Twitter saw this, formed the connection, and went on a rampage that it's transphobic because of the supposed allegory that the Unknown is a caricature of "transwomen". The tranny voice actor saw this drama, and wrote a crybaby article about how offended he was at the Dead by Daylight staff. You wanna know what's ironic about this? I wouldn't have even connected the dots of the Unknown being a huge joke on trannies had it not been for TRAs loudly making that connection in the first place. Next is the tranny voice actor seeing the parallels so well that he took offense. Then there's the irony of this unintentionally "transphobic" move on Dead by Daylight's part despite shoehorning that ugly ass LGBTQ+ flag all over their trial maps. The fact that the Unknown can be seen as an allegory for trannies only makes it even more repulsive, and would give me another reason to sprint at break neck speed in the game. And finally. Finally. The tranny voice actor? Zoey Alexandria? Yeah, he fucking DIED. Not even a month ago. HOLY SHIT.
No. 2007460
>>2006333>>2006345>>2006349thank you, nonnies. i truly appreciate the advice and the concern. i’ll try to gather the strength to tell my mom as soon as a i can. i’m thinking about doing it in the morning. she needs to know.
he was on r/mtf posting about how he was seeing changes on hrt after only 4 days of use or something if you want to know just how delusional he is. he doesn’t take care of himself at all, and it’s terrible to watch. he was a premie and an extremely sickly child. watching my mom essentially lose him to his delusions after he survived so much as a child is terrifying. she’s scared he’s going to kill himself.
i don’t think i can bring myself to cut him off entirely. not yet at least. that being said, he is definitely willing to cut me off. he removed me from all of his social media because he knew i was telling our mom about his bullshit. he’s blocked my phone number and called me a bitch and whore in a fucking cluster b rage before. he’s horrifically unstable and he’s just been allowed to poison his body because that’s apparently the best thing we can do for mentally ill men that want to be lesbians.
i may update after i tell my mom. thank you guys for caring about her. she truly is a wonderful mother. and, yes, she’s painfully aware of agps now thanks to him.
No. 2007479
>>2007474i just told my mom. she got home late and i realized i should just rip the bandage off. she called him. she’s on the phone with him now trying to figure out what the fuck he’s thinking and doing.
resources would be greatly appreciated. i think his biggest issue is his mental illness rather than porn addiction, but i think porn fed into the illness. he’s trying so hard to convince her he’s stable and feels great about himself. she doesn’t believe him, obviously. i guess we’ll see what happens. it’s all so much.
No. 2007517
File: 1716022830825.jpeg (500.08 KB, 1170x1705, IMG_3354.jpeg)
Oh wow youre so counter culture. You’re so rebellious
No. 2007609
File: 1716035068138.jpg (34.02 KB, 540x275, tumblr_8017420667f91a09d23bca1…)
No. 2007819
File: 1716047503941.png (119.43 KB, 714x712, gametes.PNG)
>>2006899Serano's argument against gametes being binary is that different species have different gametes from humans. This is such a ridiculous point to bring up when talking about human biology specifically. What's next, some animals have wings so human-to-bird transspecies is
valid?
No. 2007929
File: 1716052340588.png (997.54 KB, 750x2139, 5Btdald.png)
lol
No. 2007951
>>2007609based
>>2006712same. this moid i know is trooning out and keeps sperging out everyday about how he's getting "girl drugs" and is "gonna dress like a huge slut" and i just hope he gets sick and dies at this point from injecting this shit into himself. i used to have sympathy and feel bad for him since he's autistic but i can't take it anymore
No. 2007965
>>2004390kek this is so true. I'm so sick of interacting with people who label themselves as nice and act like they're sooo much kinder than me simply because they say anything and everyone is
valid including troon shit and never criticize anything. they'll call me a bad person simply because I don't do the same and have committed thought crimes or whatever in their eyes. they'll ghost people, act like massive pieces of shit, throw a tantrum if you have any differing views from theirs, be emotionally unintelligent and unavailable, and somehow think they're still a nicer person than me just because they validate mentally ill people's delusions. i wish i knew actually nice people instead of these larpers
No. 2007970
>>2007930>when you get out of bed in the morning the most important thing you have to do all day is tell the world what your gender isi legit wish my life was this easy
>office supervisor (..) police (…) are all human constructsisn't everything a human construct?
>deep down your real job is to reproduceah, so that's why trannies advertise themselves as the opposite gender, in order to attract people with the same genitals as them, which we all know it's the way mammals reproduce
also, kinda homophobic
No. 2008016
File: 1716056738180.jpeg (193.33 KB, 750x835, IMG_0137.jpeg)
>>2007929>>2007930Decided to look it up to check if people were dunking on it in the comments. This article was initially posted in 2016, and the single comment there is a based woman who commented on 2022.
Fuck me, 2016 and trannies were spouting the exact same retardation as now.
No. 2008684
>>2008675>trans Healthcare saving livesI can dismantle the entire tranny myth that gender reassignment surgery stops suicide attempts with one single detail:
it doesn't. IIRC, suicides and attempts actually increase AFTER 'gender reassignment' surgeries. This argues that trannies are NOT, in fact, happy after they get what they want. So when they swear that 'trans healthcare' is productive and will "save lives"
they are lying.
No. 2008706
File: 1716086739898.jpeg (380.52 KB, 589x848, IMG_0720.jpeg)
This is gonna get me banned for “attempted infighting across boards” yeah lol ok but god this copium is so pathetic. Men. Do. Not. Care. About. Women. They see lesbians as a porn category and not as actual humans beyond a sexualized pov. It’s autogynephilia simple as, straight men are able to turn into AGPs, the very thought of pretending to embody the traits of women is what turns them on. Trannies are just mentally ill sex pests and straight men certainly do not give a fuck about suffering women all around the world, they are more concerned about what gets them off.
No. 2008713
>>2008684They will rebuttal that the suicides are caused by transphobia even though society at large were always neutral towards trans people. The issue is that no matter what we do for troons as a society, it will never be enough. They don't seek to be treated as normal human beings, they seek to be worshipped as gods. The sooner we as a global society can criminalize troonery, the quicker we can go back to ignoring them.
>>2008706The perceived purity of lesbian relationships is literally part of the fetish many agps have for lesbians. That anon is engaging in serious wishful thinking. The same troon talking about lesbians being so pure will also have a scat fetish on the side.
No. 2008720
>>2008706I don't see why your post would be considered infighting. In fact, I absolutely agree with you. When I saw that post, I thought that nona was viewing them from too much of a sympathetic lens and attributing too much empathy in troons. When, on the contrary, troons tend to end up
lacking empathy. For example, many of them readily admit and say "I don't care about making women uncomfortable, I'm going to use the bathroom, you stupid
TERF cunts." They're absolutely narcissists, and there's already a high comorbidity with NPD or other personality disorders. That aside, as you mentioned, men don't care about women's issues or the violence they as a group impose on women. Those men view lesbians as a porn category, and they've gone so deep in their porn addiction that they want to become a woman and be a "lesbian." That's the short and simple answer. There's no need to embellish it with men having a guilt complex and seeing the reality of violence against women. If that was the case, those very men would take the time to make the world a better place for women by standing up for them or offering them help. Instead, those men troon out and impose their will on women and harass them into compliance. It all perpetuates the same old patriarchal cycle. It's all so tiresome, isn't it?
No. 2008727
>>2008716Troons are the ultimate “not like other men” men. Societies expectation of men, and womens expectations of men especially, are of a stupid violent exploitative rape ape and so troons seek to not be like other men by presenting themselves as harmless laydees who just want to be bffs and soft uwu princesses instead of the rapists we suspect them to be (and that they often are). Whether societies expectations of the sexes are
valid or not isn’t really the point but nlogs and nloms seem to suffer the same delusion that if they could just prove societies expectations wrong they’ll be treated like they’re worthy (obviously that means something different for each sex).
No. 2009168
File: 1716108757792.jpeg (98.33 KB, 1200x797, IMG_6333.jpeg)
>>2008684The only data that suggests people are ‘happier’ (not the same as being less suicidal) after taking steps to transition comes from people who are polled immediately after first taking those steps, so people who’ve just started hormones or just had surgery. What we’re seeing is the result of pain medication, the short-term antidepressant effect of testosterone, one hell of a placebo effect and the high that addicts experience when chasing the dragon. There’s a reason gender clinics don’t follow up on their patients or collect long term data because that would clearly show this is all very short term and that their mental wellbeing only goes downhill afterwards when the high wears off and the consequences of their self-inflicted health issues become more apparent. It’s easy to ascribe any subsequent suicides to ‘transphobia’ if you purposefully neglect to follow their mental health trajectory after chopping them up. Transgenderism is medical malpractice on every possible level. I suspect we’ll be seeing more instances like that surgeon’s online review that was essentially an accusatory suicide note from an ex-TIM.
>>2008713>They don't seek to be treated as normal human beings, they seek to be worshipped as gods.Pic related. They’re literally a self-appointed priest class.
No. 2009361
>>2008706Her observations on yurifags are correct but it's just part of the disgust they have for their male features, which is itself related to AGP and whatever collection of fetishes they have. Funnily enough some male detransers and 4chan dwellers will attempt to blame feminism for making them this way, it's a deflection from why they really loathe their masculinity (because it gets in the way of their fetish).
TiMs might get really into feminist theory and go on and on about being 'sex traitors' but it's still in service to their 'one of the girls' feelings, and they never lose sight of their male interests in the process.
No. 2009627
File: 1716144912535.jpg (70.13 KB, 750x766, FcsulKDWYAI-CLJ.jpg)
I hate how we went backwards in terms of progress, the T is the cancer of the community.
No. 2010414
File: 1716186432165.png (50.26 KB, 1638x314, idiocy.png)
It makes me so freaking mad that every time I go to look up a female health issue, all the "legitimate" medical sites (Medical News Today, Cleveland Clinic, etc.) say "people with cervixes" and similar BS. Why should I trust anything these people say about medicine when they don't even know what a woman is? People say to stop being obsessed with the gender issue, but it's impossible to do that when it gets shoved in your face just for reading stuff about female health.
No. 2010630
>>2009627Statement such as "being trans is not a medical condition" "but medical treatemends are demanded ASAP"
"Born in the wrong body" "The true authentic-self" -> I'm born in the wrong body i was supposed to be rich and skinny.
No. 2010663
>>2010436Same, and only for other women. Especially tifs, actually, not because they are actually masculine but because hey, since I'm not pretending to a man, I must have some innate feminine essence they've ascended.
That's how I thought when I was a young gendie at least.
No. 2011699
File: 1716267519511.png (138.45 KB, 1336x554, Screenshot 2024-05-21 at 00.51…)
>>2011384Nope, completely flip flopped again and went back to saying he's a woman according to wikipedia. he wrote about it on a now deleted wordpress blog.
https://web.archive.org/web/20221229055132/https://elisashupe.wordpress.com/2022/03/03/elisa-shupe-setting-the-record-straight-about-james-shupe/ not sure what he's up to now, maybe he flip flopped again.
No. 2011736
>>2011699Oh, that's unfortunate. Thanks for the update.
>I continued to suffer from debilitating gender dysphoriaHope he gets therapy for his dysphoria and realizes it does not make him a woman.
No. 2011743
File: 1716270141312.png (285.36 KB, 1868x832, article.png)
>>2011739Agreed. After reading about the abuse and PTSD he endured I feel really bad for him.
Unfortunately, it looks like he's a ChatGPT activist now too:
https://www.techpolicy.press/dont-let-the-copyright-fight-take-away-my-ability-to-create/ No. 2011997
>>2010660What would the moid way be? When it happens I do get this retarded urge to act more masculinely around the person causing me to feel this way, and in my understanding that's what retarded moids may do as well.
>>2010663When it comes to TIFs I feel a strange kind of schadenfreude for being able to be masculine and a woman, while TIFs are too weak to do that and thus have trooned out.
No. 2012319
>>2011743"democratizing force in the creative arts"
That's certainly one way to describe plagiarism.
>>2011778The stupid thing is that it's not a vision any more than just reuploading some random shit they found on Google images is.
No. 2012502
File: 1716318782667.png (1.19 MB, 960x833, 1648215568197.png)
I think that this troon shit will not go away on its own, I think it will take at least another 10 years, enough time to study the long term effect of horse piss on humans, like when cigarettes used to be advertised on magazine and now they don't even have colorful packaging but they keep selling it so smoke junkies don't jump off a bridge, I'll believe it will be the same with hormones. Idk, weird feeling.
No. 2012717
>>2012502I'm just wondering what will gradually make it stop. There will still be transpeople after it stops being trendy (to use your cigarette comparison, my parents were around when smoking was advertised to kids and are still smokers). I honestly think it'll be the detransitioners and if the current "transkids" on puberty blockers grow up.
>>2011736>Hope he gets therapy for his dysphoria and realizes it does not make him a woman.His Substack and interviews were taken offline but I explicitly remember him mentioning in a blog post that therapists refused to help him to the point he sought out Christian conversion therapy. He had an interview on Benjamin Boyce where he said even medical professionals wouldn't help him unless he re-identified as trans. I don't have that much sympathy for him because he also detailed how he coerced his wife to pretend to be a man during sex and rope her into his fetishes, but for people like him I have no idea how someone can "get help" when therapists and medical professionals buy into gender identity.
No. 2012895
When I was in college in 2022 my intro to human reproduction class had a mid 30s non-binary woman guest speaker tell us that being non-binary means some days she rather wear pants than a dress. In a room full of women wearing pants. I’m pretty sure none of my classmates were obvious gendies but when we were assigned to come up with a list of class rules the first one everyone agreed on was respecting pronouns. I’m so glad I don’t go there anymore
>>2012502Why is it always about dating and being sexually attractive? Why does that have to be the second line of even this
No. 2013255
>>2013240AYRT and I agree. Most of the lesbians I know have been openly lesbian for years and so if they refuse to date AGP scrotes they are immediately dogpiled and interrogated about their 'genital preferences,' they have men coming into lesbian events and gatherings trying to infiltrate because AGPs are obsessed with the validation they get from thinking they're dating/interacting with real lesbians, etc. As a bi woman I have gotten away with being way more of an open
TERF socially because I can stick to mixed-sex normie dating environments and if some gross AGP hits on me or sexually harasses me he can't start acting like I'm rejecting him because he's male lmao. I'm glad the bi women I've met have been on the TERFy side but I think part of it might actually be because dating both men and women you kind of get used to the differences in male and female dating dynamics and behaviour, some of them used to be more gendie/trans supportive but then couldn't keep up the farce because they knew what it was like to date both men and women. This sounds condescending and I'm sorry but some of the lesbian women I know seem kind of naive about male behaviour if they've spent a lot of time in all-female spaces and will be way less world-weary when some man infiltrates because they're not as used to men trying to hit on them in 'lesbian' spaces. Like one of my best friends over the last decade is a lesbian and she was always making these weird bemused excuses for AGPs who tried to infiltrate lesbian spaces and dating apps because she used to mostly keep all-female social groups and seemed to like really 'want' to think of the men infiltrating those environments as women, idk if I'm explaining coherently.
No. 2013512
File: 1716347796427.jpeg (841.15 KB, 1179x1836, IMG_3216.jpeg)
>>2013486openly discuss your views and see how they react, also go for older therapists. my therapist is a woman in her 50s and she has trans-identifying clients but doesn't fully get or agree with gender identity crap. she's not full on GC but it's fine with me, she doesn't censor me.
Pic rel and link is for a directory of trans-critical therapists. I can't verify or vouch to how current it is though.
https://beyondtrans.org/therapists/ No. 2013606
>>2013255>This sounds condescending and I'm sorry but some of the lesbian women I know seem kind of naive about male behaviour if they've spent a lot of time in all-female spaces and will be way less world-weary when some man infiltrates because they're not as used to men trying to hit on them in 'lesbian' spaces.AYRT, I disagree and I do think that is condescending because lesbians do deal with men in our daily lives despite not being romantically involved. The only lesbians I know like that are middle-aged, settled down and don't deal with how the dating scene is, and the only MTFs they've known were HSTS gay men and not trying to fuck them. I've grown up sexually harassed by men and despite never dating them I've peaked from seeing how similar MTFs act to (or are) pornsick men I knew as a teenager. Men liking lesbian porn and saying "I'm a lesbian too, I like girls the same way, and now people take it seriously instead of seeing it as a joke. I don't engage in IRL spaces but I tried being in a normie queer space and I swear any actual lesbians are under gag order to not say anything that isn't kissing their asses. I only became mask-off GC 5 years ago but that was because I was called a
TERF for saying that there's nothing wrong with being "same gender and same sex attracted" despite claiming transgender is uwu
valid. Outside of the febfem/TERFy bi women they were ones grilling me about accepting transwomen.
No. 2013613
File: 1716350257548.jpg (109.73 KB, 736x1258, 1000026480.jpg)
The absolute delusion.
No. 2013862
>>2013465These people are just legitimately retarded there is no other explanation. Imagine in 2024 thinking that women wearing pants is GNC. Wearing skirts or dresses is much rarer.
>>2013486You're probably SOL nonna unless you know someone personally who can recommend one, in most countries now being a 'gender critical' therapist is illegal and will get your license taken away.
No. 2013867
>>2013487NTAYRT but actual actively bisexual women are different than "bi" women. Obviously fake-bi women and fake-lesbian women are the worst offenders of gendershit but actual bisexuals in my experience usually hate troons and are more open about it than any other demographic.
>>2013500It's possible but in my experience the type of woman you're talking about usually uses the word 'queer' or 'pansexual' not bi. Calling yourself bi is usually a sign that you think there's 2 sexes and don't love gender nonsense at least where I live, most people into TRA rhetoric will identify as 'queer.'
No. 2014078
>>2012502I think it's going to linger but it definitely won't be mainstream. It's currently a trend among kids, like being a vampire witch was a trend among kids in the Livejournal days. Plus, the aesthetic really does appeal to kids. Bright hair, weird haircuts your parents would never let you get, sticker book tattoos, outfits that came straight out of clown Tiktok- it's like a honey trap for 13 year olds.
The hormone thing is probably going to take a lot longer than 10 years to study. Until troons stop being a political hot topic nobody will want to fund actual studies on them in case they come out with results that offend the brave and speshuls. We all know troons are chronic liars who will do anything to play into their own delusions, any studies that require self reporting will be unusable. Moids already think they have a feminine figure after taking DIY horse piss when they just got fat, any results they reported would be Reddit fanfiction about their desirability to lesbians.
No. 2014265
>>2013255>some of the lesbian women I know seem kind of naive about male behaviourI’ve noticed this too, particularly socially awkward lesbians in female-dominated environments (hobbies, work) who aren’t very conventionally attractive and so tend to get ignored by men. They seem to have an idealised fantasy image of males in their heads that’s informed by media like tv shows and books rather than real life. They’re especially sympathetic towards men they deem to be marginalised in some way and will handwave their misogyny as an excusable trauma response. Of all the women I’ve known who’ve defended incels and other male sex pests as “just misunderstood” and tried to shame other women into “giving them a chance”, the majority were lesbians. I think they overempathise with these men and project their own good intentions and issues with marginalisation and sexuality onto them and so take it personally when other women think the men are creepy.
This is especially noticeable with TIMs but not exclusive to them. One friend of mine keeps trying to befriend shitty Muslim moids and being surprised and disappointed when they turn out to be homophobic as well as misogynistic. For some reason she can’t accept that other women avoid these men
because the men are shit and not because the women are all mean shallow Karens unlike her enlightened and accepting self.
>>2013884This too, except not just flirting but sexually inappropriate behaviour in general. Like they’re far more likely to give men the benefit of the doubt and excuse blatant sexual harassment as “awkwardness” because their only insight into male sexuality comes from sanitised works of fiction and they can’t imagine anyone being a scumbag on purpose. And if a man turns the harassment on them they ascribe their revulsion to their lesbianism and assume that straight and bi women would (or should, if they were
kind) be cool with it. I’m curious to see this play out with a TIM, but TIMs tend to leave these women alone in my experience. Lucky them.
Of course not all lesbians are this naive and many (most, probably) are well aware of male depravity but it’s definitely a pattern I’ve noticed with the hardcore TWAW ones in my life. I guess you’d have to be naive and blind to real life social dynamics to spend any time around TIMs and not peak.
No. 2014658
File: 1716395915802.jpg (272.55 KB, 1080x1593, IMG_20240523_001316.jpg)
Logical transphobia by one of their own
No. 2014942
>>2012954>>2012961that's so creepy. the closest thing I experienced to troons trying to skinwalk me was them asking me for tips or something and asking me how to be "feminine like me" and even then that was already gross enough. also it's like, I'm not necessarily surprised it's more so just how they all act
exactly like how I see people here talk about them. it really makes their whole argument that like, you're just generalizing, hating or being a bigot or that the theories around agp and whatnot are fake just seem even more like a retarded cope. like if they're really so different and unique and it's not a mental illness, there would be more of a variance in behaviors and not always the same "symptoms"
No. 2014983
File: 1716408423334.png (84.82 KB, 621x593, IMG_2179.png)
just found this venn diagram I had saved that a nona posted in one of the old gc threads and thought it deserves to be reposted
No. 2015177
File: 1716414546109.jpg (393.42 KB, 1080x1986, 1621592580288.jpg)
the most pathetic TRA libfem
No. 2015467
File: 1716428450848.jpg (333.63 KB, 1080x1621, Screenshot_20240516_144013_You…)
No. 2016112
>>2016057samefag, you literally cannot make this shit up.
he got super drunk, settled down i guess after my friend ‘supported’ him, and i practically ended up babysitting them both. he came inside and lied down after sperging in typical ‘autistic moid drinks alcohol for the first time’ style.
after a while, considering my friend was also fairly drunk, i believe he took advantage of a moment within their drunk ramblings. he said some retarded shit along the lines of ‘to be comfy, i need to like be squished. one on this side, one on the other’ gesturing to either side of where he was lying down. my friend was too drunk to understand what was happening so he just said ‘no, nevermind’ once she asked him to repeat it. it’s pathetic because the only support he gets from her is because she’s a faghag, yet he seems to still be enacting his fetish on a girl who so clearly just views him as a gay dude. honestly, i’m feeling really affirmed rn lol, people always say ‘oh the weird ones are only online, thats a small minority!’ yet one of the first times i go out in a while, i encounter some fucking perverted freak.
No. 2016132
File: 1716466083653.gif (1.46 MB, 344x344, disgusted.gif)
>>2016112>he said some retarded shit along the lines of ‘to be comfy, i need to like be squished. one on this side, one on the other’ gesturing to either side of where he was lying down. my face when reading that
No. 2016166
>>2015467kek that comment section is full of milk
>>2015476no you can't i had my comment auto-deleted several times because it said suicide
>what video is thiscybergirls sillypoo
>>2016028i think you're reaching, nothing in these posts suggests the TIM
asked OP to buy him a bear.
>>2016147retard
No. 2016225
>>2016057>honestly his voice doesn’t even sound like hes on hrt.NTA but I think HRT only changes the voice in TIFs; you can't un-deepen a voice that has already been deepened by testosterone. TIMs can only try to make their voices sound higher with voice training.
(Could someone please confirm whether this is true?)
No. 2017230
File: 1716506573968.png (11.24 KB, 797x160, Screenshot_693.png)
i feel like i've noticed a trend in people starting to coddle and excuse HSTS on Ovarit and i find it really frustrating that they don't see that they're just as misogynistic and creepy as AGPs, they just aren't as aggressively autistic and follow social norms better
No. 2017504
>>2017230I've stopped browsing Ovarit because it seems to be filled with middle-aged women who are self-righteous about being nice, and as a zoomer with anger issues I can't relate. I like this site because it doesn't make me feel like the meanest person in the room.
Also,
>Trans legal status should apply exclusively to HSTSs>we shouldn't be allowing biological females to transition at allWhy the double standard? Seems pretty sexist.
No. 2017729
>>2017504>middle-aged womenYeah i think that's it. I find Ovarit to be fine, honestly, but middle-aged (and older) women aren't dealing with the same shit as Gen Z. This is how you get older lesbians thinking the younger ones are rude for not 'letting' the TiMs 'live'. People get mellow with age, they're out of touch with the zeitgeist. Older generations are also more concerned with institutional acceptance, so they tend to make exceptions ('HSTS are fine, they have
real gender dysphoria') to seem reasonable. ROGD for boys is another example of this, they needed to feel 'fair' and find an explanation that softened the (disgusting) reality of AGP in young men/teenagers.
There's still a significant group of older women who get it but they get chastized by others for rudeness, 'homophobia', etc.
>>2017504I wouldn't say it's entierely sexist, she probably thinks chemical castration for HSTS is fair game, but never okay for women (fine, whatever). HSTS-only trans status is hardly feasible though. AGP troons made up the majority of HRT patients, even back in the 70s when it was supposedly 'only gays'. Maybe she hopes that medical institutions will have women's best interests at heart and nicely weed out the perverts, but male fetishists were historically the main target of 'trans care', down to the first attempts at SRS.
No. 2018374
File: 1716582505384.jpeg (137.49 KB, 1125x508, IMG_3861.jpeg)
It’s so fucking over. Also the post was satirical compilation of Taylor Swift photos with SCUM quotes put on them and libfems couldn’t handle it. The any kind of misandry = TERFery rhetoric was the most effective psyop.
No. 2018426
File: 1716584250924.jpeg (216.51 KB, 1125x977, IMG_3862.jpeg)
>>2018385>implication that we are misogynists Hmm. I wonder.
No. 2018766
File: 1716598893019.jpg (65.71 KB, 487x575, 434543454352.JPG)
Why is there so much backhanded racism like this in the TRA community?
No. 2019420
File: 1716625911292.png (61.32 KB, 761x586, 05_25_24_14_26_chrome.png)
>>2017230I still look at ovarit very frequently and coddling HSTS to this level is a rather fringe opinion, you can see the commenter say it herself that she thinks her opinion is controversial (picrel is one of the replies to her comments). majority of the women there direct most of their hate at AGPs but also acknowledge that HSTS are also harmful in a different way.
The other nona said it correctly, ovarit userbase on average are older and just less prone to shittalking than your local lolcow anon, and also bound by the site rules of no slurs (sometimes I do see posters mention being zoomers though, but it's not common). I can see why the site wouldn't appeal to imageboard users in general but it's not a tradwife hangout like I've seen some nonas in past threads claim.
No. 2020275
File: 1716663408357.mp4 (1.21 MB, 576x1024, 12b236b80eef43bb17812cb0300bdf…)
Gee I wonder why
No. 2020575
>>2020275The thing that always gets me with troons is their coy denial of reality. It's been repeated to death but there's something really strange about their relation to rules and how they relate to the world around them. I get that creepy feeling even from seemingly 'asexual' (low libido) TiFs, like they can't somehow comprehend that being a woman with a short haircut and baggy clothes doesn't fool anyone. 'Gee! Can you imagine! I got she/her'd at the grocery shop!' well we can imagine because we have eyes and are slightly less mentally unwell than you. And they expect you to play along with their perverse little game of denial, constantly testing your beliefs ('oh, you said women only, but you
know i'm a woman… riiight?' , smugly stating they have they/them pronouns or whatever). It's like stepping into a dysfunctional home and pretending everything is alright for the sake of whoever invited you, nervously laughing at whatever you are witnessing. TiFs/TiMs make this dysfunctional mindset their constant reality, enforcing it everywhere, offline, online, to unsuspecting people etc. It's a little different from autistic/furry retards who just seem to completely ignore rules, and a little different from AGPs who have a precise target in mind (themselves) and totally disregard others (though it often overlaps). The 'chaotic queer TiF drag queen' type especially seems to thrive by acknowledging she's
actually a feminine woman beneath the fake provocative denial and subversive identity. This is why so many of them larp as femboys, these otherwise feminine TiFs will go on subreddits for masochist troons and write essays about how they want to be abused and 'found out' as female. They desperately want their lie to be uncovered to make it worthwhile, unlike more autistic TiMs/TiFs who just skip over 'normal' sex (as in, mutual sexual relationships involving genitals) and use each other as fantasy fuel. The most autistic ones invoke pity or revulsion because they're barred from enjoying normal sex to begin with (unless they really try) or are very antisocial. Self-aware kinky redditor spicy straights are, weirdly enough, far more irritating because of all the reasons detailed above. The absolute lack of boundaries is another issue with them, they
love to tell on themselves, talking about their ebic 'gay' hardcore sex, their oh-so-queer hookups etc. If these women weren't troons, they would most likely still be a flavor of mentally ill queeriospecial, dwelling in 'alt' communities like goth or emo, wearing their psychosexual issues like a badge of honor. I have a lot of compassion for the younger ones (obviously) but by the time you're 25 you should have wrapped up the embarrassing adolescent angsty navel gazing shit
No. 2020707
Does anyone else remember the exact thing that peaked you? It was like 4+ years ago when the MTF threads first appeared and r/itsafetish was still kicking. I used to be a massive handmaiden before finding lc but seeing reddit screenshots of MTFs talking about stealing underwear from their mothers and sisters and other trannies validating it as relatable and harmless made me feel so disgusted that it made me transphobic in like a week, and that no, these ugly balding men do not have repressed womanly souls.
>>2020275She just looks like a masc woman
>what about this is giving she/her (nails emoji)So women can't be women unless they're hyperfeminine? I feel bad for normal gnc women who get mistaken as gendies because of this
No. 2020708
>>2020275Gender is just clothes!
I refuse to use tiktok, but sometimes i wanna make an account just to troll/confront gendies.
No. 2020718
>>2020708For me it was a series of things that ultimately 'peaked' me totally but I can remember some of the specific things. One of them was some article on a popular news/editorial site where an AGP troon was talking about how 'he received female socialization while male.' He tied himself in knots trying to explain this like when girls got subtly treated differently than boys he 'internalized' this. I remember trying really hard to be a good 'ally' and explain this to my boyfriend at the time and he kept being like 'huh?' and I was like yeah that doesn't actually make sense now I explain it in plain language. Trying to be a TRA made me actively find it more nonsensical because when I tried to summarize the points myself I realized they made no sense.
Two of the other really big moments I remember slowly peaking me were 1. being on tumblr and all those '
TERF blogs to avoid' and someone listed Ophelia Benson's blog, who's an evolutionary biologist. I used to be an evolutionary biologist as well before I switched fields and had followed her blog in the past so I checked it out to see what the '
TERF' thing she was saying was and it was just a really basic post about sexual dimorphism. Then shortly after that someone reposted something on facebook about Chiminanda Ngozi Adichie being a '
TERF' because of saying 'women and trans women's experiences are different' and even after she apologized she kept being berated. I read the facebook comments and they were absolutely chock full of easily clockable hideous male troons gloating about how they're 'better women than cis women' in a very degrading way and claiming 'cis' women are just jealous, I think that's when I snapped and went to one of my saved tumblr posts about '
TERF blocklists' and read every blog on the list.
No. 2020721
>>2020707I defended then 10 years ago on the basis of "live and let live" and "who are they even harming by dressing in unusual clothes", I thought they were like the LGBs who were campaigning for gay marriage at the time. I thought the tumblr neopronouns were obvious bullshit but tried to be respectful of people who wanted to be called by existing pronouns of a different gender.
Then they started asking for access to women only spaces like bathroom. It seemed blindingly obvious that unscrupulous men would seize that as an opportunity to prey on women and girls and yet nobody seemed willing to admit that it was a risk. Then I saw posts from the gender critical subreddits including itsafetish documenting what these people were actually saying and doing including, as expected, assaulting women and girls in bathrooms. Instantly peaked and lost all sympathy.
No. 2020748
>>2020707I had an ex on the verge of trooning around the time I found this place, so it ended up being a combination of the two. Seeing how he considered himself a woman, but had all these aspects of male socialisation and privilege he failed to recognise made me start to connect some dots. He also just hated being male. I don't think he actually understood what being a woman was, or meant. I was never a full blown handmaiden but in that relationship I began with sympathy and ended it in utter disgust.
It wasn't even a sexual thing for him, he was asexual (had mentioned a brutal sexual assault he endured by other men but I digress), but one time he said he wishes he didn't have a dick or vagina down there, just nothing. When hearing that combined with everything else he told me and knowing he wanted to transition I kinda wondered if he saw women as full, sexual beings with healthy desire.
Either way, he was heavily autistic, and since him every troon I've met and interacted with has shared at least some traits with him.
Tl;dr the best way to peak is actually closely interacting with troons.
No. 2020773
>>2020160>12 year old>incelTwelve-year-olds
should be involuntarily celibate because 12 is below the age of consent.
No. 2020800
>>2020791Oh yeah I know what you're saying and that's why I'm like 'as a bisexual I have no idea what to think about this.' I wasn't even saying you 'can't' be born LGB, just that I'm not 100% sure all cases of being LGB are 'born this way' cases. I am a scientist and after reading lit about it it seems like there are multiple factors that can lead to someone having a 'non standard' sexuality, some seem to be pre-birth and others seem not to be. I'm not projecting anything on gay people because I'm not gay so I don't think I can even imagine what it's like to be gay but I have looked at science studies showing that certain people with certain hormonal irregularities in the womb predict homosexuality, but then that other homosexual people have 'unpredictable' presentations. I also know gay people who said they were 'attracted' to the opposite sex until their mid-teens and then suddenly stopped, and I don't want to invalidate their experiences either.
I will say that my personal experience was that when I was around 5-12 I thought I was 'attracted' to males only, then after some traumatic experiences I 100% stopped being attracted to males and thought I was lesbian (and other people thought I was lesbian, I was horrifically bullied for being lesbian, my parents abused me thinking I was lesbian etc) for several years, then due to the bullying I tried to 'act straight' for a while and discovered I was selectively genuinely attracted to males sometimes, but I remain primarily female-attracted. I went through so many mindfuck moments in my life due to my sexuality seemingly 'changing' though and I think some of it could have been due to social inluences/'nurture.' I have quite a few gay and lesbian friends and it's kind of mixed between what they've said to me, some of them saying 'everyone knew' they were gonna grow up gay when they were like 5 and others saying that they felt 'genuinely' attracted to the opposite sex until later. I think until there's a clear answer I won't have a clear cut opinion either way but my main point is it shouldn't even matter. Even if someone wasn't 'born' that way but developed same sex attraction in puberty it's still rapey and disgusting to try to 'turn' them. It just is.
This is a minor thing but I have the 'male pattern' ring finger length lmao. I always wondered if that 'predicted' my bisexuality.
No. 2020811
>>2020800Oh my bad, i misinterpreted your response a bit sorry im tired and get defensive over that stuff quite easily. now that I understand more i agree with you alot actually, imo homosexuality is a very case by case thing. I think trannies are very similar to moids in the way that they try to peer pressure lesbians (or even women simply not interested in them) into "unlearning" their sexuality. So yeah I agree, i think in all cases of same sex attraction, one's sexuality should be respected no matter the case. I do wonder though, do bisexual women have trannies on their backs as much as lesbians do?
>This is a minor thing but I have the 'male pattern' ring finger length lmao. I always wondered if that 'predicted' my bisexuality.interesting, i know a female bisexual relative who has it too.
No. 2020827
>>2020811Yeah I know what you're saying and I get why you would feel defensive but I have the somewhat unpopular opinion that while 'born this way' is a convenient way to just get people to leave you alone, it shouldn't be necessary to respect someone's sexuality. In 2024 it should be known by any person in a western society that consent is important and interrogating 'when' someone knew they were gay shouldn't be necessary or important. If a woman doesn't want to sleep with women she doesn't, period. Even as a bisexual I have had multi-year phases where I was never attracted to men at all and would cringe thinking about getting close to men physically and just because I've had boyfriends in the past people would question me and gaslight me like crazy about saying I'm not interested in men at this moment.
I posted earlier in this thread but I actually don't think bisexual women have AGP moids on our backs as much as lesbians do. I think for one thing AGP moids are obsessed with the validation they get from thinking they're dating a female-exclusive homosexual and specifically seek out actually lesbian women (or women who claim they are) to validate this delusion. For another thing I think that as a bisexual woman you can just say 'I'm not attracted to you because I'm not' and they are more likely to just accept that because they would feel like weird rapists if they pushed you on that knowing you're okay with 'both' sets of genitalia, but when it comes to lesbian women they will think 'oh this woman doesn't see me as a real woman' and try to convince the lesbian to sleep with them. As a bisexual if I tell some troon 'sorry I'm not into you' they can't argue it's because I have a bigoted genital preference.
I have had tons of troons be really predatory toward me specifically because I'm bi and they assume I'm therefore okay with 'the queer community' but I haven't had the kind of cotton ceiling pushback my lesbian friends have, I also don't think male troons are as interested in me once they learn I'm bisexual.
No. 2020835
>>2020822The 'best of both worlds' thing is so stupid lmao. No you're the worst of both worlds. I like women when they are beautiful and have women's bodies and act like women, I like men when they are beautiful in a male way and have masculine bodies that are hot, troons are the worst of everything. Bad style, stinky, stupid interests, trying to develop mannerisms and secondary sex characteristics of the opposite sex, mentally ill, gross hobbies, and a lack of confidence in who they are. Everything about them is offputting and entitled.
I know some bisexual women say they're into extremely feminine women and extremely masculine men, I'm not, I actually tend to like more 'androgynous' people of both sexes but I'm still drawn to their sexual characteristics. I tend to like beautiful women who are more GNC and beautiful/pretty men who are a bit more GNC as well (not in the troon way). I'm never going to be attracted to a mentally ill freak abusing their body with cross-sex hormones and ill-fitting clothing, ever.
No. 2020836
>>2020811>do bisexual women have trannies on their backs as much as lesbians do? they put such a big emphasis on being/dating "lesbians" because a bisexual, especially one who primarily likes men, may not see them as a true and honest woman. I know a self-described lesbian who solely dates MTFs and she is incredibly popular with them. I'm bi and dated an MTF
in high school, he was a pretty goth twink with pronouns ok who would call me a lesbian, which really pissed me off. He loved bragging about his "cis les gf" to his tranny friends and honestly, it was one of the moments that peaked me. Like rather than liking me he was only attracted to the idea of being a lesbian, and I was a prop for his vanity. The way he was so fetishistic about being "irl yuri" made me so uncomfortable.
No. 2021172
>>2020791Yeah people often use the 'born this way' debate to basically deny lesbianism for their ideological purposes (trans ideology, sexual orientation self-ID) even if it's irrelevant. The 'born this way' concept deserves to be criticized like any other theory but you have to be stupid or in denial to act like sexual orientation is not fixed after a certain age (probably very early on, since people report getting homo/hetero crushes in childhood). Bisexuals who think they're so enlightened for bringing up fluidity are really embarrassing, it's like they lack a theory of mind and can't imagine others having a different sexuality.
>>2020707>Does anyone else remember the exact thing that peaked you?There was a pre-peaking when i looked up 'gender theory' (before it was big online) and found the then-TRAs to be weirdly forgiving of the John Money experiment. They talked about it like it was a fun little scientific project that validated them and not a horrible case of child abuse. I was instantly peaked by how agressive TRAs were in very early tumblr transactivism days (the 'die cis scum' shit). Went from 'i wonder who these transsexuals are, no one talks about this' to 'nope'. Soon after i picked up fetishist vibes from activist TiMs, it was too obvious for me to ignore. I had no idea of what AGP was then but i sensed something was deeply wrong. Last nail in the coffin was seeing my entire friend group of nerdy girls troon out in record time.
No. 2021468
My coworker told me his daughter has identified as a tif since 11 years old. He says it is because bad relationship with her mother, but of course as a typical moid he loves to blame the ex wife for everything. The daughter just sounded like she is a bit nerdy and gotten neglected in the divorce, reminded me of myself at that age. It is just that now we have social media to groom children and even schools teach about gender shit. I feel so bad for little girls.
>>2021172How do people think that sick experiment by a pedophile proves anything. A boy is horribly mutilated (even a frankenvag needs penis tissue, he would have had literally no genitals), drugged with hormones and molested. He doesnt just happily think he is a girl. This means gender?
No. 2022323
>>2020707I distinctly remember being in the mtf thread and realizing that there could never be any such thing as a "real" trans. I'm not sure what sparked the thought but I realized I was being inconsistent with my logic and basically either they're all fake or none of them are. It was easy to apply the same logic to TIFs, especially as I'd been close to quite a few and it was very obvious what kind of mental issue were motivating their choices.
Up until that point I'd been treating them with a "wait and see" mentality and I was facing intense pressure to toe the line being newly out and only having gendie friends + my gf was a handmaiden at the time. It felt incredibly dangerous to realize that I was willingly rubbing shoulders with a bunch of predatory men. It was also disheartening to realize that I was enabling women who were dealing with deeply internalized misogyny (not to mention figuring out why so many straight, homophobic transmascs were so hostile towards me).
This is what they fail to realize. Very few female allies truly believe in the cause. Compliance seems mostly motivated by social pressure and fear. And they're right to be suspicious of feminists, because I noticed that the women in my friend group who peaked first were the ones who cared a lot about politics and actually bothered to learn the rhetoric and construct good arguments. Yet another sad case of what happens if you listen to trans people.
>>2022125Kekkk I'm so sorry nona. Pathetic of her, why didn't she just go work out?
No. 2022371
>>2022125If you still know those people call them out on it now years later because that's fucked up kek
"remember when i was broken up with because my shoulders are too wide and you felt bad for HER" I'd leverage that any time this person went against me or mentioned any kind of body shaming in any way kek
No. 2022378
>>2020707>Does anyone else remember the exact thing that peaked you?It wasn't one single event but one absolute key thing was my friend showing me Blaire White (i know, cringe kek). That was the first time I saw anyone who (in my then tumblrina groomed mind) wasn't an evil right wing nazi complaining realisitically and making fun of nonbinary gendersplats. When a "real" trans person points these things out it suddenly had merit and I was finally allowed to listen. It finally clicked that it really was bullshit that mentally ill girls are calling themselves "he/fae/faeself" and dress up in pants and call themselves "real men", switch to a skirt tand they're suddenly "fae" the next day…
As much as lc hates Blaire he really is useful when it comes to peaking people, he's a good first step.
No. 2022570
>>2020707It wasn't just one thing but some small things that happened over time. I used to support that shit for 10 years but in 2020 when gendie crap on tiktok blew up and people started using neopronouns and those retarded made-up genders, it was downright ridiculous to me and gave me intense second-hand embarassment. And the behaviour of my gendie peers was always off-putting to me but I could never put into words why that was. I guess it was because of how extreme a lot of them were. And like another anon said, out of curiosity I started watching Blaire White videos and other similar videos by other YouTubers. Then one day I found lc
while looking up Cryaotic kek and wondered what this site was. Lurked for a few days, and instantly peaked for good.
No. 2022645
>>2020707I was a handmaiden for a long time because I grew up on tumblr and thought not believing the “trans women are women” mantra made me an evil bigot or whatever. Still when I saw people I followed online I immediately disengaged from them because it just found it difficult to believe they truly were the gender they said they were, it was easier for me to accept trans people who I already knew as trans. I also found it incredibly unattractive how these people were at a war with their own body. I thought this was some internal prejudice I had lights I should unlearn, but I didn’t try very hard to lol.
When I reached my twenties I started to question gender ideology and not feel guilt for it. I saw a tumblr post that said “kids should be allowed to medically transition because kids deserve bodily autonomy” and thought that that was dumb. By that logic you could allow kids to do hard drugs, get tattoos and extreme bodily modifications, which most people would consider
abusive and neglectful.
I then began deconstructing other ideas. I began to read more stuff critical of TRA’s. I actually used to read radfem tumblr blogs before I peaked and agreed with a lot of what they said but repressed it. Idk why. I guess because I was being told these people were evil and irredeemable. I also looked at more normie people critical of TRA’s like Jesse Singal. I realized that in a lot of cases gender dysphoria was no different to regular body dysmorphia, so it didn’t make sense to treat a mental illness with surgery and by pandering to delusion. I also realized how misogynistic the movement was and came to really dislike TIMs.
Peaking was actually a very good feeling, I no longer had to feel guilty for having eyes and knowing what a woman is. Also when I saw Lolcow mentioned on a gossip discord I started lurking and this site helped with that too. The trans movement really is extremely religious and realizing that it’s all bullshit is such a great feeling. If I ever have kids I’m going to be careful with their access to the internet and make sure they learn critical thinking, because I don’t want them to be indoctrinated by internet weirdos like I was.
No. 2022657
>>2020707Unironically, being tomboy-ish and having a tim bf made me peak.
I had a faggy male leaning bf and I hated myself that even his crumble of attention was fine until I saw him using my bras to do shit in chatroulette and I was like "hmm okay it's fun tricking moids" and after the bras, the makeup came. He destroyed all my makeup like a kid would do with expensive gouaches, I was heartbroken and his excuse was "Well, I'm experimenting!"
Then the first dresses came and that's when I peaked: he was calling himself a woman, saying that those things made him a woman. I never wore a dress in my life nor heels and I remember thinking "Then what I am if women are heels and dresses?"
I always struggled to being seen as a girl because I liked being a girl! I wanted to be one! And I actively fought these stereotypes (maybe being a bit of a nlog in my teen years saved me from this madness), when I saw them coming full circle, that's when I peaked and then realized that troons were cosplaying women in the most narc way. Hated that. I love how actually listening to troons makes people peak.
No. 2022674
>>2020707The EXACT thing that peaked me was going through a terrible ritalin experience, burning out, crashing, having to go to an outpatient therapy group, then while I was doing my usual scrolling of lolcow I finally unhid the MTF and FTM threads and took the plunge. I was slightly scared, but I kept reading them both and I finally peaked completely. What also helped was that I had one very stereotypical "big boy uwu" FTM and a very stereotypical "quiet autist" AGP who wore a shitty wig. They were very stereotypical representations of trans people.
For background, I have been on tumblr for over 10 years or so, assimilated into their little tranny loving cult, only interacted with FTMs because I only had FTMs in my school but every single interaction with a MTF made me so uncomfortable for a reason I couldn't explain, plus I felt annoyed when people would go on about "the first female [whatever]" but it was actually a hulking male troon but felt bad about it.
The MTF and FTM threads helped me come to terms with my feelings about trans people and then trans ideology as a whole. It took like 7 years of scrolling and lurking lolcow before I finally looked at the troon threads because at first they annoyed be on the basis of troonphobia, then they started to catch my interest but I felt really bad for it. Then the ritalin thing happened KEK and I read every single troon thread from the beginning and I still keep up and contribute somewhat.
No. 2022700
>>2020707Mainly being exposed to TIMs online and reading what they were saying about lesbians. I was pretty live and let live about it when I thought TIMs were primarily feminine gay men but AGPs always kind of gave me a bad feeling. Didn't ever make sense to me that they could be homosexual females, at first I was kind of okay with them being in lesbian groups because I assumed they were hoping to date the bi women
This is cringe but the final nail in the coffin for me was fandom drama lol. The 100 was airing and I was seeing posts circulating like "Attention cis lesbians: There is nothing interesting about two white cis women pairing up. You have a moral duty to pressure creators for more trans women in lesbian couples! Also if you must engage with this horrible stupid oppressive pairing make sure you give one of them a penis, if you disagree with the G!P Lexa headcanon you're an evil bigot and forcing trans women to kill themselves.". Yeah we have an entire internet filled with disgusting futa/female porn but I'm the bad guy for wanting to write fic with normal lesbian sex. It made me so cranky that I started researching it more and lurking trans subreddits and reading Autostraddle, initially I was trying to convince myself that Tumblr trans were a minority and of course "real" trans lesbians would be more reasonable, but everything AGPs say about lesbianism and womanhood was so gross and wrong it peaked me completely.
No. 2022717
>>2020707Volunteered in an lgbt centre a long time ago when troon numbers were low. We had a new monthly support meeting for them and I found myself reluctantly stuck sitting in on one. There was a single youngish TIF whose whole personality was telling people how sexy they feel as a 'guy' now. All the women they get. Was barely 5 foot tall and it almost seemed like a satirical play on how actual men brag and exaggerate about their insane appeal with the ladies. Think heavily inspired by johnny bravo. Wasn't so much there for support. Seemed deliriously happy about how great life is as a ladies man. Was the lil odd one out amongst the otherwise all TIM bunch. Sat with her legs spread as far apart as possible because.. man
The TIMs summed up; middle aged men who had either semi abandoned or already abandoned their families for the sweet allure of garish dresses. The biggest issue discussed was their bastard kids not auto calling them mommy 5 mins into hearing the news. Which of course means you never speak to your kids ever again, that's a no brainer. I sat there and thought.. this is who we're supporting? We're providing a free space, free staff (mix of volunteers and paid) and free refreshments to these well off old clowns
Middle aged men fucking off and leaving their families so they can instead go spend tons of time and money on something new.. that used to be men having affairs. Struck me that they're essentially just being their own mistresses in some sick way. Obsessed with becoming a sexy woman rather than chasing one. Spending a fortune on trying to look the part but making sure to avail of free services for 'support' at this hard time. Men who could just up and leave and rent a second home to go and play dress up in.. aww the poor things. Such
victims despite them doing whatever they please. It won't be good enough till their kids cheer em on.
And the TIMS who were so sensitive about pronouns n being mommies.. kept calling the one TIF there a she throughout it.
No. 2022825
>>2020575It's the cult mentality. It's kinda similar to when you go to a deeply religious but pretty isolated community where the waitstaff pray at you for not saying grace before your meal and the shopkeepers go on unprompted monologues about Jesus and the Rapture. Except they only see the fruits of their lunacy after death, and troons have to live with reality. Does the woman in that video look like a man? No, and a man in her outfit wouldn't look like a woman. But they need to convince themselves that they can warp reality. They put mascara on their lip hairs to pretend they look manly, cut their hair, learn angles to pretend their bloated red acne-riddled faces aren't feminine, end up looking at themselves exclusively through filters, get surgeries that don't do anything to make them look more like their chosen gender or make them look less like their actual gender. Every second of a troon's life is a performance. At some point they look in a mirror or see an unshooped pic and something inside them crumbles, so they double down on the crazy. If they venture outside their echo chambers they're faced with reality. So yeah, they do always enforce their gender shit everywhere they go. If the waiter misgenders them it shatters the illusion that they're totally the opposite gender and nobody can tell. There's also the sunken cost fallacy to consider. When you burn bridges and physically alter your body into a bootleg drag performer you need the rest of the world to play along, or you'll be forced to admit that you did all that for nothing, and there's no going back.
>>2022676I assume that most of the ex-TIF posters were women who hate read the troon threads and eventually peaked. As long as they're out of the cult that's what matters. It's also a place they can speak to other women without having to tiptoe around male feelings, which I imagine is important to them since peaking/desisting/detransing will instantly kill a TIF's entire social life and estrange her from her friends.
No. 2023094
>>2020707I very recently peaked, about 2 months ago. Before peaking, I was an extreme TRA for years, but parroted whatever tumblr and TRAs told me. My peaking started when I was trying to find pro trans arguments to be a better ally. Every argument I read just made me more unable to defend my beliefs because it all contradicted each other. No one could agree on anything. I was more confused.
For some reason this thought of, "if my brother started identifying as a woman, would you honor that?" popped in my head. I said, no way, he would just lie to get with women, he wouldn't be serious. But that went against my "if they say theyre a woman, thats all that counts" argument I had.
It all went downhill from there. I tried to find comfort in womens forums or blogs online since I didn't have anyone IRL to turn to. I was so fucking annoyed how every safe space for women spent more time saying how twans women are women than actually advocating for women. It felt so disgusting that no one could talk about female issues without saying not all women have a vaginas! some have penises! don't forget that!
Found refuge in the radfem side of the internet. Before peaking I made genide, tif/tim friends, now I don't know what to do. It can feel lonely at times, but it's also freeing that I'm no longer lying to myself. I no longer feel guilty for not wanting to date a TIF, that I won't have to pretend to be attracted to their frakenpenis in order to look progressive, for daring to say something like pregnant woman instead of people with a uterus, birthing bodies, etc.
I dream I can find radfem friends IRL one day. Its true that the more you listen to tims/tifs, the more it peaks you.
No. 2023168
>>2022825>they double down on the crazyI've seen this happen in real time and know exactly what you're talking about. A TIM I'm forced to be around in real life got the chop last year, then a revision surgery, and I can only assume he's in pain and is unhappy because now he walks with a limp and he's introverted and never willing to make small talk with me (although maybe that's just due to his autism, or maybe he can smell the
TERF on me because I don't yasslight him like the rest of the women in our social circle do). Obviously he can't grow his dick back if he detransitions, but a few months after the surgery he got "SHE/HER" tattooed on his chest, right below his neck, to double down on the crazy. I keep waiting for the day when he inevitably either 41%s or commits a mass shooting.
No. 2023446
>>2023168I also know a TIM who became incredibly introverted and had problems (limp and was bedridden for like half a year) post-SRS, it really changed his whole personality though he went from happy-go-lucky outgoing and friendly to withdrawn, stopped being friends with everyone, acted jumpy if you ran into him outside.
>>2023443Man I'm sad I missed the Yaniv discussion on this site, I had to follow the other farms for news on him back then because I hadn't found lolcow yet and every other website was censoring all Yaniv discussion.
No. 2023494
>>2023471Okay sorry for my aggressively worded response then, I am just used to people arguing 'but you're bi so you don't respect gay people' whenever I bring up some relatively unpopular opinion like this, which has more to do with the fact I can't find any research or even anecdotal evidence clearly showing orientation is set/can be known at birth than my own personal experiences. I think it's shooting ourselves in the foot to lean too hard on 'born this way' arguments as justification to give LGB people legal protections because then it's easily co-opted by troons, pedos, fetishists etc. claiming they deserve special considerations because of being 'born that way' too when the point is they are harming people and asking for special privileges and gay/bi people are not.
I agree with you about the 'penis trauma' thing being a bad idea, you should never have to explain to any man why you don't want to sleep with him whether you're lesbian or straight. 'I don't want to' is a sufficient reason and a man who doesn't leave you alone after that is a creep/potential rapist.
No. 2023503
>>2023398There was a hot day last summer when I could smell his frankenvag from like 10 feet away, but these days he wears a lot of scented body spray, he's probably self conscious about how his crotch wound smells.
>>2023446Is that TIM still alive? Does he live independently, does he have a job?
No. 2023601
>>2023587Oh sorry I'm dumb, apparently he is still alive, someone saw him recently but he quit his job, school, and torched all social connections he had before/deleted social media so I don't know anything else about how he's doing now.
Sad because he seemed pretty well-adjusted and happy by TIM standards before the SRS.
No. 2024275
>>2023094>My peaking started when I was trying to find pro trans arguments to be a better ally. Every argument I read just made me more unable to defend my beliefs because it all contradicted each other. No one could agree on anything. I was more confused.Same, it hits a point where they contradict each other directly. Like for example they'll loudly and proudly say
>"denying trans people life-saving surgery that they literally need to not die is transphobic"And you go, yeah that makes sense, of course trans people need their life-saving surgery! But then the then the next guy says
>"thinking trans people need surgery is transphobic, you're just disgusted by the transness and want them to perform oppressive cis-ness"and you sit there like wait- I guess that also makes sense…? So do they need life-saving surgery or not..? And you desperately try to find an explaination that makes the double-think true somehow, but instead you just find more and more contradictions until you snap out of it and peak.
No. 2024352
>>2024275I definitely peaked because I attended a transgender student club and several trans-focused events with my trans-identified friends back in college. At one trans club meeting, we were talking about stuff like getting the university to add gender-neutral bathrooms, and let trans students choose roommates of the same gender (opposite sex), which seemed reasonable to me at the time, but then the club president (a TIM) abruptly changed the topic to “Do you think it’s transphobic for someone to refuse to sleep with a trans person because of their genitals?” This made me go “Hmmm…” I remember saying something like “If the person is already willing to hang out with you as a friend (and not commit a violent transphobic hate crime against you) why do they also have to be willing to sleep with you in order to not be transphobic? Why is just being platonic friends not good enough?” and I didn’t receive a satisfactory answer.
Also, at our university’s transgender day of remembrance event, I remember this badly-passing AGP man talking about how it was transphobic that he was constantly groped and sexually assaulted, but also he shouldn’t have to pass and perform perfect femininity to be respected as a woman. This also made me go “Hmm…” I now realize that him talking about being groped and assaulted was probably just him sharing his AGP fantasies - he probably got a massive euphoria boner from standing on a stage with a microphone, sharing his sexual fantasies with a room full of people.
Also, realizing that my 3 closest trans-identified friends in college were all deeply mentally unwell people - in particular I’d known my best friend since high school and I could see how her transgenderism was tied in with her (likely) autism, sexual trauma issues, issues with her bi/homosexuality, self-harming impulses, and her general feelings of alienation for being a weird nerd girl. We haven’t spoken in years, but she’s still a TIF, she’s dating another TIF who posts BDSM porn of her, and she uses it/itself pronouns. So sad. I wish she’d wake up and leave the cult but it’s been more than 10 years.
It is true that listening to trans people will eventually make anyone peak.
No. 2024411
>>2020707i never really believed in any of this shit deep down but i used to be the type to say oh just let them live or whatever and believe in trutrans to some extent. then my bf said he wanted to troon out and at first i was trying to be a handmaiden and in denial that this was going to destroy our relationship until i realized how sad it made me and how alone and isolated i felt because i felt like i couldn't tell anyone how i felt out of fear of being called a bigot. then i found radfem spaces and other "trans widows" and it helped me fully peak and decide i didn't want to put up with that shit anymore and made me understand how retarded it all was fully. i always thought it was odd people couldn't just be gnc and had to call themselves trans or whatever to begin with but that was what fully made me go anti trans rethoric. and i have to say ever since i've felt more isolated than ever and it's been rough since despite knowing a couple of people who don't believe in tranny shit a large majority of my friends still believe in that shit and loads of them troon out…and it's just like, i can't really say anything or just watch it all unfold. it made me realize people are incredibly stupid too since they'll have shit happen to them and still remain retarded or delusional. knew a girl in the same position as me with the bf turned tranny thing but she stayed with him for example and still capes for trannies and it's just sad
>>2024275it's weird to me how people don't peak even after this, i've known a lot of people who even when you present those contradictions they don't change their mind at all.
No. 2024734
>>2024352I already posted my peaking story earlier in the thread but what you mentioned about knowing troons personally was part of what made me initially start doubting gender ideology before I fully peaked. A bunch of my female friends from highschool (both online friends and irl friends) all trooned out around the same time and it was all the same 2 types of people - either shy 'asexual' autistic nerd girls who couldn't find boyfriends and assumed they would be 'cuter' as a man or girls with severe trauma issues who were doing shit like receiving anal sex in public and bragging about it because they were so fucked up by trauma. No 'normal' functional girl I knew back then ever tried to troon out, so it was pretty obvious it was a sign of being either autistic or mentally disturbed.
The only male troons I knew when I was younger were also autists.
No. 2024736
>>2024411The weirdest situation I know of is a girl who is basically a '
TERF,' used to go on r/GenderCritical and was pissed off that reddit deleted the
TERF subs, but for some reason this whole time has been dating and now is about to marry a mentally ill autistic troon who doesn't work and freeloads off of her. It's so weird like she will say all this outright
TERF shit to my face but is going through with marrying this useless troon who doesn't even have a job. Why are women like this
No. 2025135
File: 1716938930673.png (304.62 KB, 710x972, predictable op username.png)
>acting like disgusting TIMs are even remotely on the same level as butch women
if anything we'd be owed a thousand unapologetic butches to compensate for even one of these shameless parasites.
No. 2025150
>>2025135you can tell a male wrote this because not all tomboys are butch
and also because it's gay and lame
No. 2025274
>>2022600I'm
>>2020748 and I relate to you
nonny in that I'd pretty much always been chill with trans people (didn't care, knew some but not in any intimate capacity) until my ex trooned. I felt pretty isolated because everyone around me was just so open and accepting but I was starting to have some serious doubt. Not sure about you but I went through the phase of "he's not reaaaally trans" before stumbling upon here.
No. 2025494
File: 1716944941121.png (552.26 KB, 800x600, 1102189221.png)
>meet they/them enby whose circle overlaps with mine
>actually seems kinda cool, hope she's another butch lesbian
>she's a literal aiden who calls herself gay as hell and only loves dudes
>tries way too hard to seem tough and fit in with the guys, even the ones who are jerks while ignoring how uncomfortable the girls around them are
>we're generally polite with each other but sometimes she laughs at my silly jokes
>today she misunderstood my joke, then continuously berated and made fun of me in front of everyone else
Damn, why do nlogs have to be this mean…
No. 2025627
>>2025499AYRT and yeah when I still thought he was female it just seemed utterly bizarre and incomprehensible to me, then as soon as I realized he was a troon it all made sense as typical gay moid behaviour and it was such a mental relief to realize what I was witnessing. He would even openly hit on my (extremely uninterested) boyfriend in front of me and then wink wink nudge nudge me claiming my boyfriend was into him, I didn't feel threatened but it was so extremely weird because women basically never do this, but it made sense realizing he's gay and a lot of gay men are more OK with sleeping around even in relationships. There was this really bizarre combination of overwrought 'girl power' 'omg girlies' type behaviour that seemed very middle-school to me and nasty competitive male-pandering behaviour where he didn't seem able to relate to women at all that made no sense to me on a subconscious level before I realized he was a troon. Also lmao despite what troons will say about feeling 'even more unsafe' than real women he would act confused when me and my friends offered to walk him home late at night which again just seemed extremely bizarre to me. What 5'2 woman would say 'no haha why would I be scared' to a group of friends walking her home at 3am in a seedy part of downtown?
The other big tell was that he was super flirty with and into like literally 60+yo scrotes as a 19-20 year old, I never saw a woman unironically thirst over some geriatric moid like this guy did.
No. 2025646
>>2020707What peaked me was TIMs. Even when I was a trans ally I was always skeptical of transwomen, I figured the HSTS men on TV were fine but I was never comfortable with the concept that someone can live their formative years as a man with male privilege being a woman all along and understanding what that's like. There was also a thing on TV about a transkid and I thought it was weird and creepy, even a classmate who skewed conservative thought that it'd be no big deal if this was a 20 year old, but this was an actual kid being "turned into a girl" just for liking dresses. I read some old school gender theory from the 2000s and thought some of it was regressive, but I thought that this was just a small minority of people and it's not like they would turn the tide of things. Then when I came out as a lesbian at 19 I saw the whole genital preference/"lesbian sex can include PIV"/"you're a hypocrite if you're willing to be friends with transwomen but not go on birth control to date them" shit and it horrified me as a rape
victim who spent my teen years going through homophobic abuse. I thought the mantra was that we were born this way and that conversion therapy is abuse, but now "gay" communities support it? I figured
that was just a minority of trans and they would just seethe on Tumblr, but once again I was wrong.
No. 2025661
>>2025646Yeah nona idk how anyone can regularly interact with TIMs and not come out of it thinking they're predators, especially AGP TIMs. Even when I was more supportive of gendershit (I was never TRA/fully libfem but like you I thought oh it's a tiny minority with dysphoria, I'm sure they're harmless) whenever I met a TIM irl it was always the creepiest, most low-effort scrote and I kept trying to tell myself 'I'm sure most of them aren't like this' until I couldn't anymore. I genuinely think most women who unironically support TRA/troon shit just haven't interacted with many TIMs irl because they would peak anyone.
Like you said it also makes no intuitive sense that a man can be raised and socialized male his entire childhood and adolescence and even early adulthood and somehow 'relate to' or 'understand' what it's like to be raised female. How would that even work? The shit you deal with being raised female is shit 99% of males don't even notice at all, they are too accustomed to thinking of themselves as the human norm to even consider what girls are raised like. Talk to basically any normie moid that hasn't read a bunch of feminist lit and you'll see they never even noticed 90% of the shit girls were subjected to growing up and probably won't even believe you if you tell them. So how can these specific moids claim to be so extremely sensitive to the female child experience that they not only noticed it all but 'internalized' it even though it wasn't directed at them?
No. 2025841
File: 1716957969643.png (943.47 KB, 828x445, a3939e3ea48549c3a3083e7801d187…)
something i have noticed as a very tall woman is that TIMs consistently treat me with absolute contempt once they realize i am an actual woman and it’s honestly so funny to me at this point, like it’s obvious enough that even my friends can pick out when a tranny is staring at me like they want to wear my skin.
i frequent a number of spaces that have a disproportionate number of troons in the community and they are typically all ogreish and obviously male, like i have never met a single TIM that comes anywhere close to passing, and it’s kind of a known thing in some of these spaces that if you see someone over 5’10 in a dress it’s almost definitely a man. they often bemoan their height and insist that if they were just shorter and smaller they’d totally pass and that the only thing that outs them as male is being “too tall” for a woman. and then they come face to face with a real live natal woman who is the same height as them and yet so unmistakably female in comparison that it’s often impossible for them to hide how hard they are seething lmao
No. 2026069
>>2020707I was into Jfashion and there were always sissy fetishists trying to ingratiate themselves with my local community to use us as fetish fodder. Before gender ideology really took off everyone acknowledged that these men were sexual predators who should be banned on sight. Then around ~2013 there was this shift towards a more sympathetic (that is, naive) attitude because “some of these people might actually be transwomen, who are the most oppressed people evar and the only reason anyone might feel uncomfortable around them is ignorance and bigotry!”
All of a sudden we were supposed to welcome these men with open arms and give them the benefit of the doubt no matter how inappropriately they acted towards us. Being told to suppress my intuition regarding predatory men (who we all agreed were perverts only like a year ago) already set off plenty of alarm bells, but then I found out that the most deranged, pornsick, serial-killer-in-training horrorcow I knew had been allowed to fully legally and medically transition. He showed us the fraudulent sex marker on his passport and threatened to show us his designer rotpocket, too. That shattered the concept of “true trans” for me. If a fully trained team of psychiatrists and surgeons could look at this guy, who had a raging cluster B personality disorder and couldn’t go five minutes without saying something misogynistic or oversexed, whose entire social media presence consisted of degradation porn, and say sure, this is a legit transwoman, then clearly there was something very wrong. Either transwomen could be dangerous sexual predators in a way not meaningfully distinguishable from men or the process that determines who is genuinely transgender is a farce.
It’s both! It then clicked that the better behaved ones weren’t women either. No men are women, no matter how they behave or who they’re attracted to or how they dress. I had peaked and there was no going back.
No. 2026417
>>2026268the right to call himself a woman without forcing anyone else to do so is included under free speech, so unless they live in a 24/7
terf surveillance state
aka. what they think the UK is kek there's no reason to "want the right" in the first place as it's something they already have.
No. 2026686
>>2024418I had a similar concept, forget the exact words, handed to me when my old friend tifs out and I replied no she killed my friend and trashed her fucking name.
It was to my boyfriend at the time, husband now who was peaked separately by one of his old friend group becoming a cam"girl" and my tif revealing her true shithead powerlevel
No. 2026787
>>2026268I would question what the root causes are that drive him to desire to refer to himself as a woman because it is 100% always rooted in misogyny. I do not associate with any man that believes he understands what it's like to be a woman because it is an inherently misogynistic delusion that can only exist if he has little to no understanding of what women actually experience. In my
terf utopia he would still be sent to a labor camp.
No. 2026804
File: 1717017186610.png (121.8 KB, 621x593, venn diagram.png)
>>2014983Awww, anon! I made this forever ago. Here's the accompanying TiF version from back then.
No. 2026961
>>2026268I’ve found the most self aware trannies are the HSTS. They still say some viciously misogynistic shit because they’re gay men but they’re less insecure and at least bond with the faghags, so for me it’s less a division between what’s requested and more a division between AGP and HSTS. I automatically do not trust AGPs no matter how innocuous they claim to be, where HSTS I can give the benefit of the doubt.
Also like other nonas have said, that’s technically protected under free speech/spiritual belief. I’ve grown to not believe in trutrans and see it as a spiritual belief like religion and from then on it’s how well the person can integrate despite their belief. HSTS broadly integrate with women better and I respect them on that regard. AGPs are universally degenerates and should stick to their own cliques like flat earther and qanon retards stay in their own circles
No. 2027161
File: 1717038879353.jpeg (43.54 KB, 326x297, 1642323969298.jpeg)
>>2026936>would you rather a dead son/friend or a happy trans daughter/friendYeah, and it also assumes that troons are guaranteed to kill themselves if they don't medically transition, which just isn't true. The Cass report found that the suicide rate for trans-identified people is about the same as it is for other mental illnesses, like schizophrenia, autism, and BPD (all of which troons typically have). What this means is that there are confounding variables; it's difficult to be certain if the suicidality is caused specifically by the gender identity issue. The same report also indicated that there isn't a strong base of support for the idea of transitioning actually reduces likelihood of suicide attempts. There are some studies that indicate a reduction in depression symptoms, but that could just as likely be because GIDS required patients to receive ongoing talk-therapy.
>I recently lost a friend to the trans movement and it's like they're dead because after transitioning her personality switched to a chronically online twittard one and it's like speaking to a scripted botYes, something very similar happened to my best friend after she began dating a TiF. Luckily, her personality has yet to be completely eclipsed by the ideology, probably because she's maintained connections with me and a few other non-crazies. I'm still so fucking angry at her TiF girlfriend, though. Trying to turn your girlfriend into a clone of you isn't love, it's abuse.
But to your point, it
is basically like your friend or relative died and their body is being puppeteered by a cultish ideologue that acts and speaks identically to thousands of others just like them online. You just kind of hope that some day they'll snap out of it, and luckily, they occasionally do (though not as often as would be ideal, which is always.)
No. 2027239
First tranny I met was actually an AGP in the late 00s. Since I was young and stupid I just accepted him as being a tall, kind of ugly looking woman. I met him through an anime convention forum that lets you find roommates. Was dating a woman, didn't realize that she was straight and dated him since pre-transition. Quickly learned how abusive he was to her after spending more time with them. Classic tranny narcissism, just throwing male rage fits and screaming at his gf in public. And having no self awareness. I remember he was fishing for compliments trying to ask if he could pull of a Bayonetta cosplay, then insisted that he could kek. Also, since I'm tomboyish and kind of frumpy he had the audacity to try to "fix" me too, since he's clearly an expert on it!
Whats funny is their friend secretly hated him and would misgender him behind his back. Sadly now she's a massive TRA and they're still friends. I looked back on his Facebook and he's still done nothing to fix his fucked up non passing face, just keeps getting breast implants every few years. I don't know what it is with AGP trannies where they neglect face surgery in favor of breast augmentation. His body, like many others, have that male fat distribution problem where having large boobs just makes him look top heavy and hunched over, whilst his lower half is all compressed.
It's funny to look back on now. I only peaked in the last 3 years or so but that should have been a sign.
No. 2027269
File: 1717046348541.jpg (130.53 KB, 1220x440, 1000007141.jpg)
Funny, you would say the same thing about TRAs.
No. 2027281
File: 1717050380411.png (210.03 KB, 1394x790, Screenshot 2024-05-29 at 11.21…)
Everybody point and laugh
No. 2027305
>>2023443Oh shit
nonnie, that is the same exact thing that peaked me. It was kind of a fateful day seeing that discussion on the front page back then, because I never would have even heard about it if it wasn't for this place
No. 2027316
>>2026417This, they already have the right to call themselves untruths. And we have the right to disagree.
If you mean legally, then no, they shouldn't be allowed to lie on legal documents.
No. 2027405
>>2026393>>2026427>>2026787Agree with all of these. TIMs are inherently misogynistic, deceitful and predatory. There is no such thing as a harmless TIM. Even kids like Jazz Jennings who are
victims of transhausen by proxy are contributing to the erosion of women’s rights and boundaries. If you agree that one kind of male can be considered a woman then why not other kinds of male? It’s not in the nature of TIMs to ever be satisfied. If you give them a finger they will keep pulling and pulling until they’ve ripped your whole arm off.
Men can call themselves women in the same way that anyone can claim to be a reincarnated Napoleon Bonaparte. Being mentally unstable and delusional shouldn’t be a crime. But those delusions shouldn’t be given any kind of legal weight and nobody should be expected to play along with it. It shouldn’t even be considered kind to play along, because then it will automatically be expected of women to do so. It needs to become common knowledge that men who want to be called women are coming from a place of fetishism and misogyny and that women are fully justified in avoiding them. We need to treat transgenderism like we treat transracialism. Not illegal, but definitely embarrassing and offensive.
No. 2027411
One of the saddest thing about TiFs is witnessing their rapid disillusionment as they settle into their 'transition'. In my experience there's always a moment when you can tell 'oh she's pretty aware she's still a woman and will never be taken seriously'. Recently a TiF i know reacted strongly to 'misogynistic men are spiritually gay' talk but her reaction was really different from your typical woke response (saying it's homophobia, missing the point). She ranted about how 'us gay men' aren't a garbage bin for shitty men who can't respect women. She very clearly spoke as a female, because there's no way an actual gay man would be this badly hurt by witnessing misogyny. She went on and on about how much it sucked to have a dating pool comprised of such men, and you could sense her slow realization that the so-called 'gay men' she dated were really bisexual or straight perverts at most. Every time i hang out with her she (briefly) complains about extremely female-typical experiences, like never being taken seriously or being prevented from solving/fixing stuff, things like that. I don't know how these TiFs can stand this life, being extremely aware of female socialization but never escaping it. She's tiny and has a frog voice, too. I'm starting to think this kind of non-passing TiF only sticks with this farce because they undergo drastic things like mastectomy really early on, as a way to fully commit before they can second-guess themselves. They most likely have terribly low self-esteem and can't imagine going back to honest womanhood with a partially masculinized body.
>>2027239>I don't know what it is with AGP trannies where they neglect face surgery in favor of breast augmentationFetishism. This word has been watered down to the point where it barely means anything now, but fetishism has always been about reducing the other (most often a woman) to an object. AGPs will always have a body part or costume or behavior they're obsessed with, breasts (very commonly), tights, shoes, a mask etc. AAP doesn't quite fit this fetishism definition, which is why fujo fakebois are noticeably different despite a common obsession for anime/homosexuality/etc. Women in general aren't prone to fetishism. A lot of AGP behavior makes sense when you realize they've given up on things like actual relations with mutual pleasure, because most of their sexual/fantasy life revolves around dehumanizing the self or the other by turning it into a thing. This is why men who are deep enough into their fetish feedback loop will ruin their marriages/jobs/families, they've already substituted normal affect for a fetishistic one and only stay in marriage because it's convenient, or to have someone to enact their sexual scenarios and help them realize their fetish in day-to-day life.
No. 2027414
>>2027411Good analysis of the AGP fetishism thing nona. Yeah I think a lot of 'normies' won't understand what male AGP troonism (and honestly a lot of HSTS troonism) is really about until they understand this. They might understand if they spend a few hours reading trans subreddits and see that many of these men admit they will take the chance of cutting their genitals off and never experiencing pleasure again for what they openly admit is a fetish. Normal people can't even imagine this level of sexual depravity and mental degradation so they think it doesn't/can't exist.
Regarding TIFs it's not only the moment where you can tell they know they are being treated like women and always will be, there's also usually that moment where you can see them going from 'excited' about physical changes to realizing they will be unhealthy and ugly forever, more and more and can't go back. Thankfully a lot of younger TIFs desist/detransition before this point but you can always see the attitude change in TIFs who were excited they were turning into 'cute boys' for the first year or two and then how they start acting when they become obese, balding, have a scruffy neckbeard and their voice stops 'dropping' and just sounds like they sucked on a helium balloon. I imagine a lot of these women are also undergoing really painful and depressing physical changes that aren't externally obvious, too. The clit enlargement is something a lot of them don't even know about beforehand and that I bet is dysturbing, many start to experience vaginal pain, some have prolapses…
No. 2027512
>>2025433I'm like
nonnie and my old therapist thought I was a TiM when I was having my TiF phase, thank God I never took HRT ("In what way are you transitioning?") same happened online, where I'd be mistaken as a femboy even if showing my face. I also remember this TiM telling me that I'm a cute "boymoder" (he thought I was like him, how deluded some people are is crazy)
No. 2027663
>>2027513There was the picture, and me going on video chat once (it's a shitty logitech webcam). The man was so weird. He was really insisting if I had a penis, and told me that I should stop trying to fool in men, I said that I had a cock and XY chromosomes, because I knew that if I didn't say that lie, he would've acted even more inappropriate with me. Men online, when they are "transmisogynistic" to TiMs, still hold more respect than when they're just misogynistic. In any way, he acted more homophobic towards me than misogynistic.
I wonder if I should go back to my therapist, because most of my suffering was around my gender nevrosis and she couldn't know how to help me.
In real life too, I get "sir"'d but it's until I talk, after that, the other person (usually a woman) meekly apologizes for her mistake.
It is hard to just not feel like a failed woman in those moments - even if there's no right or wrong way to be a woman.
But thank you for your insight. It's true that IRL, people can indeed, tell.
No. 2027684
>>2027668Oh no no no it was the opposite with the guy - I was just pretending to be a guy to be left alone (harassment by incels on women online is horrid), and he insisted I was a femboy/TiM who should take more estrogen to grow my boobs and to quit fooling men - and I said I was just a man with hormonal issues, not a TiM - Because I knew that if I told him I'm a woman he would've gone nuclear.
But you're right that a lack of attention can result to this. I go to a woman only gym sometimes, so sometimes I really see those very gorgeous and masculine women and I know they are not gendies lol
No. 2027799
>>2027771Samefag
>TIF that didn’t transitionSo like a woman’s voice then? Don’t worry about it.
No. 2027802
>>2027795Haha I do sound like my Asian friend, but no I'm around Europe
>>2027799Yeah but many TiFs try to force themselves into sounding deeper. This voice is my comfortable range
No. 2027839
>>2027806You're very sweet, thank you, I always hated my voice but I think that's everyone? I'm sure you sound lovely too
>>2027809>>2027829Oh that makes so much more sense now. I am on the spectrum so it totally went over my head.
No. 2027912
>>2027902One of my female friends has a male-level low voice lower than a lot of men and her voice is still recognizably female, female vocal cords just sound different or something. No one has ever mistaken her for a man.
I think the only time that voices are confusing is around puberty/teenagerhood, TIF T voices can sometimes be mistaken for voices of boys going through puberty and male/female preteens often have similar voices, but after that it's usually pretty obvious.
No. 2027996
>>2027411>>2027414This has been discussed here before, but it's still worth pointing out how most TIMs spend a lot of effort/money on the same few specific things: breast augmentation through hormones/surgery, body hair removal, growing their hair out (regardless of how good it looks), and aping a "feminine" voice. Everything else about their presentation is hilariously slapdash and malebrained, from the way they dress to the way they move. It's like they think that as long as they have what a man would consider feminine, i.e. long hair, shaved legs, pink/female clothes, no facial hair and so on, then they pass, and that allows them to focus on the aspects of transition that sexually excite them.
No. 2028008
>>2027996>Body hair removalOh
nonnie that's generous, kek. In my experience, most of the ones I've met don't even go
that far. Most think that growing out your hair, getting boobs, and buying a skirt and thigh highs combo off aliexpress will be enough
No. 2028304
>>2027996It's true and that's part of what makes it so funny. Seeing a 6"7 ape with bolt ons and greasy strings of hair battling past the male pattern baldness mince about in a pair of stripper heels and call himself a laydee completely unironically has peaked many TRAs. They make it so obvious that it's a fetish and nothing more. Those same moids seethe over women who like Chinese BL men with pretty faces, long hair and flowing dress-like robes, which only makes it funnier.
>>2028008They fixate on body hair removal if it's part of their fetish. If the fetish stops at putting on thigh highs and giggling in the mirror, there's no incentive to put in any more effort.
>>2028009Can you post proof or elaborate on this? Is it like Tumblr censoring trans women's blogs because they're filled with bare moobs and bulge shots, or is Instagram just deleting troon accounts randomly?
No. 2028874
File: 1717148632593.png (92.68 KB, 639x622, Screenshot 2024-05-31 054116.p…)
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13461901/Transgender-men-postmenopausal-bladder-bowel-problems.htmlIt seems like we can expect an influx of studies telling us how much testotorone fucks up the female body. Not surprised, but i've always been curious as to how tras react to such studies. I've never seen them respond to them, they always act like it they don't exist.
No. 2028881
>>202887495%. Transmen are all literally pissing themselves, their "true selves" is being covered in piss.
I've only ever seen troons combat medical lies about them when it comes from a fellow troon or makes them look "better". For example scishow recently lied about hrt not effecting the bones of adults (only teens) and a troon chimed in that "actually poor adult transwoemen suffer from poor bones due to hrt too, it makes us more like cis females with weak bones" so even then it's not honest because they don't care about the science. They're going to dismiss every study as transphobia for as long as they can, while secretly pissing themselves of course.
No. 2029280
File: 1717174412884.png (100.34 KB, 400x400, 9A947BE0-F6F9-43EA-A808-5E8484…)
>bored
>join discord server
>its full of a bunch of edgy racist gaydens
>immediately greeted by a nazi one calling people nigger left and right
>pronouns in bio
>one of them is a columbine fujo
>despite their attempt at mimicking male socialization they’re still aggressively female
Do trannoids really?
No. 2029292
File: 1717174863141.jpeg (32.22 KB, 394x375, 32C48C23-0AB4-463F-8834-3C0374…)
>>2029284Here is one of many
No. 2029338
File: 1717177492333.jpg (98.96 KB, 716x1087, 1000016938.jpg)
>>2029296Shit like this is why I feel like teenagers getting "cyberbullied" is a part of the internet's circle of life. Think of how many tranny kids would quit this gender shit if more people, even normies, bullied them for being autistic, coomerish attention-whores.
No. 2029368
File: 1717181480279.jpeg (158.86 KB, 1024x768, beutiful trans gril.jpeg)
>>1992125Sorry to reply to an old post but is chaotic enby supposed to be that Himmler looking mf from the femboy thread (can't remember his name)
No. 2029462
>>2029448Fucking
exactly, nonna. Affirming teenagers for every dumb fantasy in their head is how you end up with young women who cut their tits off and try to go as 'Aiden' because they never got the proper talk they needed about their insecurity during their teen years. More people need to tell teenagers to shut the fuck up about trooning out, and to embrace simply not being their gender's
stereotype.
No. 2029752
File: 1717201101509.jpeg (133.54 KB, 828x926, 3067A222-0468-4A2B-B363-69840C…)
>>2028304No it’s a huge mass banning of
terf and gc accounts under these new guidelines. MRAs unaffected, so the new rules are being applied unevenly.
No. 2030073
File: 1717222862709.jpg (184.27 KB, 919x528, 1000016969.jpg)
Banned GC subreddits being mentioned on the mtf thread made me go on a hunt for archives, and saved the ones I found on saidit on a pastebin.
https://pastebin.com/qUA5XYgdPicrel is one of the posts from the first ever peak trans thread in r/gc, I can't believe things were already so cursed back then.
No. 2030119
File: 1717229749565.jpeg (52.53 KB, 404x467, (Fe)M(ale)RA.jpeg)
>>2029296Kekerino. Literally the TIF MRA in the TIF chart. (S)he's a vewwy scawwy man.
No. 2030493
File: 1717263743252.png (200.9 KB, 500x822, listen to men.png)
I love how the gendies do everything they can to break free of gender stereotypes and expectations and always cycle back round to 'listen to men, defer to men' every single time.
>>2029368He's deformed, has he shooped his face so much it looks like it's melting off his skull or does he actually look like that?
>>2030145Based, please bring that up in casual conversation whenever there's a troon around.
No. 2031668
File: 1717309808757.jpeg (127.38 KB, 1079x1070, IMG_6983.jpeg)
Idk if this is the right thread to ask but I love hearing stories about how TIMs absolutely seething over irl women esp when nonnas share some features that society deemed as “unfeminine” yet they still look like beautiful women by a landslide compared to these orgeish troons. Can any nonnas share more stories like this please? Id bring me so much joy.
No. 2031977
File: 1717336228793.jpg (611.98 KB, 1080x2340, 1000008383.jpg)
Saw a cnn article about "how to react when you kid comes out as trans" and read it for a giggle cause I thought it would be like, 16 year old highschoolers or something. No, the kids it covers are 4 years old and 6, and this person asked their 4 year old "does it upset you you were born a girl" WHAT. And also the 4 year old DID NOT say that shit I don't believe it. Even worse it goes on "evan never liked typical girl clothes and activities, so it all clicked together". What "girl activities" is a fucking 4 year old supposed to like?! No comment section otherwise I'd be blowing a gasket
No. 2032324
>>2031668this may not be precisely what you're looking for but i met one of the least self-aware troons i've ever encountered recently via anime convention. and that says a lot.
keep in mind: anime conventions, extremely pro LGBTQ+ crowd, I
could not have been rude to this guy without receiving backlash or getting straght-up kicked out of the venue.
changing some details just in case mutuals lurk:
>be me, at the bar of this weeb mecca waiting for evening events to start>i'm the only one there for a while so the bartender and i make conversation, i get the impression he's flirting with me a bit>suddenly i hear what i think is someone doing a cruella de vil impression to my left>'anita daaahhhhling' intonation, very breathy and forced-sounding>i glance over to see a guy wearing a renfair tunic/skater dress, greasy-looking ponytail, tragically misapplied eyeliner, bad skin, overgrown brows, etc.>ok, nona, let's not rush to conclusions, this guy could just be into LARPing a goth scottish highwayman or - >'whahr cahn ah girhl faind somethang to drahnk ahround hyeah?'>nope, nevermind. >also the dental hygiene is terrible, like he has the worst breath i've ever encountered in my life and my sense of smell isn't great to begin with.>the troon proceeds to tell his captive audience (myself waiting for an event to start, the bartender because he works there) that he's never had anything to drink before in his life, this is his first drink ever>takes one sip of a jack and coke, starts acting like he's drunk enough to slur his words in a 'teehee aren't i helpless and cute' way while eyeing up the bartender.>bartender clearly doesn't know what to make of it, starts avoiding this end of the counter>don'tleavemeherealone.jpg>as soon as the troon realizes the flirting didn't work he starts drinking much more rapidly and starts complaining that the booze is what's messing up his 'vocal training'. >'that must be what drives people off'>meanwhile, i'm a smoker>my voice is gravelly/deep naturally to begin with>i'm sitting here matching him faked-pitch-for-real-pitch like 'yes, do go on. tell me how hard it is to be a woman with a deep voice and how unsexy your potential mates find it.'>there was more to this interaction (he actually did get drunk and started following me and a friend to panels afterwards) but the voices thing really irked me because it felt like so transparently passing off his failing to be attractive to a straight man as 'well it's just because he doesn't like girls with deep voices'…bruh, clearly he does.
No. 2032566
>>2031668I have a few!
>Be tired, covered in dust and dirt, wearing shitty old clothes, been walking around in the middle of nowhere for hours and really look it>Walk into a store for water when I find civilization, see surprise troon behind the counter, wearing a skimpy little number that really emphasizes his masculine body, and a crapton of badly applied makeup>Extreme malding from troon for the few minutes I spent looking for and paying for a bottle of water and a couple snacks>Everything from snide remarks about no man wanting a woman who doesn't put effort into her looks to passive aggressive bitching about how much time it took him to do his attempt at eyeliner to asking me if I was a lesbian because of my clothes>Be normal until I'm out of hearing range then burst out laughing because that was so fucking surreal, this huge moid was wearing a clubbing outfit to work behind a till in bumfuck nowhere and thought he passed, trannies are so fucking retarded
>Overhear troon store assistant being a shithead to a pregnant coworker>'Aww, you're so gorgeous now with the pregnancy glow! Is it going to last after the birth? Haha, of course it is! You're so pretty. I'm sure your husband will stick around! How old are you again? Isn't that a bit, you know, for a pregnancy? And it's your first, what if you want more? Oh… I guess you could always adopt…'>Woman takes it remarkably well, troon probably does this all the fucking time>While in line to pay, overhear pregnant lady talking to another coworker about how he's been at it again and her coworker offers to ask the troon when he's planning to get pregnant
>Be in city during Pride month>Two moids in extremely obvious wigs, coated in glitter, wearing evening gowns, walking down the street fuming, can hear their conversation from a mile away because moids have no concept of volume control>Think they're drag queens getting mad about some drag drama, turns out they were troons who dressed up for Pride, getting mad that other people thought they were drag queens>They then get mad at the TIF who was part of their group, because everyone assumed she was a lost lesbian instead of a drag king, despite wearing man's suit with a bowtie and putting mascara on her mustache Troons are seriously bizarre creatures. Every troon I've come across in the wild acts like a sim with a fetish, it's like they've dedicated their lives to becoming the embodiment of a handful of negative stereotypes and think that delusionmaxxing their way through life will make them real women/men.
No. 2032825
File: 1717380189724.png (92.95 KB, 1777x359, conformity.PNG)
I'm replying on this board for visibility because this is a very interesting phenomenon that I rarely see discussed as pertains to tifs. Blogpost warning, but I've been that type of self-consciously, superficially GNC but
feminine-minded girl described in picrel. I think tifs are like this inherently. One example is the predominance of anorexia among them, a feminine pathology even in the pursuit of a miniature facsimile of boyhood.
Has anyone else known someone like her, or been one?
No. 2032870
>>2032825I have talked a lot to my irl friends about this phenomenon because I was the 'first type' of GNC girl/tomboy growing up. I never wanted or got short hair except for some brief phase after seeing a girl with a pixie cut I liked but then I realized it would grow out in my face so I didn't want it anymore, I just didn't really care that much about clothes or the 'gender' of my clothes but I wanted them to be comfortable because I did a lot of sports and tree climbing and shit, and other people always labeled me a tomboy or said I was 'like a boy' or masculine, I got bullied because people assumed I was a lesbian in middle school etc. I never wanted to troon out even remotely but when I was a young adult other people pushed me to troon out so my 'outsides would match my personality' which I found jarring and super weird.
On the other hand I actually knew few girls like myself (and the few I knew grew up to be vaguely gender conforming in their look once they realized it benefited them at school/work), but tons of the second type and all of them trooned out at least for a while. Like every single one of them turned out to be some kind of enby or TIF. They were the types of girls in my middle school who self-identified as 'nerds' and were into yaoi anime, didn't do any sports or athletic/physical activities, were obsessed with drawing, crafting, video games, anime, magic the gathering etc. A mix of very feminine interests and 'nerd boy' interests for the most part. They were super obsessive about their clothes in a way I wasn't (if my mom bought me a pink dress that was comfy I would wear it and not complain, these girls would say shit about how they would nevereverever wear pink or a dress), meticulously style their hair/makeup to be aesthetic (I didn't wear makeup), etc.
I wouldn't say curating an aesthetic is necessarily only a feminine thing but it is definitely a more female-stereotyped thing to do and something young boys especially are rarely socialized into doing, so it is interesting. Also many of those girls were anachans.
No. 2032873
File: 1717382689695.jpeg (110.19 KB, 1080x1189, IMG_6681.jpeg)
>>1991983>>2031668Oh Nona, I also love these reading these types of stories on here kek… I have a lot from working in entertainment since a lot of troons run here but this one is near and dear to my heart
>be me, one of two non gendie girls at my junior prom wearing a suit >everyone is filing into the venue, im seated with my friends and just watching everyone walk in>see greasy 4chan phenotype troon walk in, the most Neanderthal male looking face I’ve ever seen >he’s wearing a dress that looks like it was bought off Amazon that had two slits on each side going all the way to the pelvis>le barf >greasy, ratted mousy hair left down with the most awful smeared makeup I’ve ever seen in my life, the black lipstick was smeared all down his chin like he was slobbering >kek notice he’s a mouth breather >anyways I go about my prom with my friends >notice troon is DEATHGLARING ME across the dance floor >im dancing the entire time with friends, troon and other female gendies are the ONLY PEOPLE SEATED while everyone else has fun >they all look miserable >troon literally cannot look away from me while I’m dancing, start to get creeped out >get lost in the dance pit area, find aforementioned other non gendie girl in pants and a button up blouse >never saw her before but we immediately sense eachothers vibe and dance together >dumb hormonal 16 year olds so we made out a few times >haven’t talked to her since but I will never forget my vaguely Slavic sounding, long haired prom waifu >back to story >I feel the troons eyes on me for like an hour at this point >le me getting touchy with prom waifu >average retarded 16 year old moment >looks back at the 41% table >the troon is looking back and forth to me and the female gendies, gesturing at us>blubbering and sobbing >kek out loud at the sight of a hulking future pedophile phenotype loli porn on hard drive ass troon sobbing at the mere sight of his lesbian classmates getting touchy >spend the night being a based Stacy lesbians with my prom waifu>I cannot emphasize how hard and focused this troon was at staring at us the entire time >also cannot emphasize how literally everyone was socializing and dancing and having fun, while the table of trons stayed glued there the whole time looking retarded and sad while talking amongst themselves >troon deathglares us while we are packing up and going home >in line to get food scraps before we leave, tell my non gendie friends and prom waifu about troon and we are all laughing like crazy while eating Mac and cheese and sprite >le troon walks by with plate >can hardly contain laughter >troon walks away and I can only presume he cried himself to sleep that night No. 2033185
>>2032870Hearing about other
fembrained tomboy wannabes embarrasses me, tbh I still present myself the way I did as a 12 year old trying to skinwalk the boys in my class I envied. Radfems don't acknowledge it but masculinity is often a performance also, to men mainly (who are striving for a level of manliness that doesn't come naturally). Sure, some idiots will call any neutral woman "mannish" but I would actually argue that none of the women described are truly masculine as defined for men. Like, body hair and not wearing makeup are neutral features, not masculine traits.
The second kind of tomboy is trying to overcome her own femininity (socialised or innate) but is working with a feminine tool kit. The same is seen in reverse as feminine men attempt to overcome their masculinity and can only do so through a male lens.
No. 2033362
>>2033358Samefag but I actually think the whole dresses/pink = girl, no dress/blue = boy thing is a result of the recent TRA/new-conservatism craze for very superficial markers of 'gender roles' because growing up I don't remember clothes being considered nearly as important as 'signals' of your 'gender identity' or whatever. I had conservative catholic family in my eastern european shithole who would let me wear full outfits of boys clothes everywhere except to Mass and they didn't see anything strange about it. I think troonism actually led to the resurgence of these really superficial aspects of clothing/makeup being considered a signal or marker of your 'gender.'
On the other hand I think being extremely concerned with appearance and presentation has been a 'feminine' gender role for quite a while, but not to the extent of some specific garment or color being the deciding factor.
No. 2033373
File: 1717402459255.png (137.1 KB, 959x636, 1673003680819.png)
Relevantly:
("thinspo" for tifs)
No. 2033607
File: 1717417701001.jpeg (240.31 KB, 736x736, IMG_1322.jpeg)
I have two trannies in my workplace and many more that frequent, they all grow their hair long and think long hair is the epitome of womanhood. I kind of want to get a short cut like pic rel so I can send them into a dysphoric spiral. My hair is pretty bleach damaged anyway so it’s pretty tempting to chop it all off
No. 2033620
>>2032867>Is curating your aesthetic a gender conforming thing necessarily though?Is the multibillion dollar industry of fashion and makeup mostly aimed at men or women anon? There are about 50 emo girls for every emo boy. They exist, but males are far less likely to make their fashion into an identity they center their lives around the way girls do.
I've to this day never seen a single boy who wears "tomboy fashion" the way "aesthetic tomboys" do. But the "behavioural tomboys" often wear the same boy fashion as the actual boys around them, because it's what available.
You can argue emo, punk or whatever other style is GNC by default for not fitting into some kind of frilly dress stereotype, but the behaviour is exactly the same and way more conforming than girls who have little interest in fashion at all and just wear basic clothes. They just target a small sub-fashion group community instead of society at large, but they're filling the exact same role.
No. 2033628
File: 1717420024337.jpeg (152.42 KB, 736x903, IMG_1105.jpeg)
>>2033611you don’t need a buzzcut, they’ll still freak out over any short cut because they know they’d still never pass.
No. 2033668
File: 1717422170814.png (121.03 KB, 722x691, lol.png)
https://medium.com/@jencoates/i-am-a-transwoman-i-am-in-the-closet-i-am-not-coming-out-4c2dd1907e42Came across this today and wanted to share it because it's such a good example of what goes on the minds of creepy/entitled gendie men who are way too into 'feminism'. I read it when it first circulated but i'd forgotten how whiny it is.
There are things i agree with, like hating shallow misandry, disagreeing with 'femininity good masculinity bad' (this drives so much of gendie logic) etc.
What's mind-boggling is the extreme hypocrisy dripping from every line. This is clearly a man who's comfortable enough in his manhood to keep his fetish compartmentalized, content to indulge in AGP on certain occasions, yet he is crying about how women are basically awful for treating him like a man when he
is one, looks like one, presents as one etc.
My favorite part is him highlighting how tragic and unjust it is when people assume he can't speak on femininity, when the examples he brings up are: wishing he was a girl (AGP), stealing his sister's costume and getting a high from it (AGP) and liking girl cartoons (hardly feminine, every man into anime recalls something similar). It becomes even more absurd when you contrast it with self reports from HSTS TiMs or feminine gay men reflecting on their childhood. He has no idea what it's like to grow up as a girl or even as a 'feminine boy'. He wants all the advantages of classic manhood, to defend his sex (the whole 'boys c-can be good actually' thing) without the transparency that comes with it. A healthier man would distance himself from campus libfems and even come to hate feminism, but that entails a certain level of honesty about who you are and what your kind does. Honesty is hard for AGP moids because they have to constantly lie to themselves about the reality of their fetish, so they don't realize how retarded they sound when complaining about misandry while claiming womanhood. This is why they're never thankful for handmaidens groveling for them, any hint of understanding of 'men' as a group/caste is already too much for their fragile self-conception.
>>2032825>>2032870This is spot on. I was a mix of both types (uncaring with some girly hobbies). I never reached TiF-levels of obsession with my appearance but being around so many TiFs was anxiety-inducing, since anxiety is contagious. I didn't care about my clothes or 'identity' but seeing them agonize over it so much was irritating, it was a constant reminder of things i'd overcome like dysmorphia. It's weird but i was way less neurotic about style before the trans craze, i think we all brushed off appearance policing as retarded/un-feminist/bothersome, something that annoying older women imposed on us. But having a bunch of girls who are similar to yourself be psychotically obsessed with looks and how it relates to their core in a novel way was strange. Before that, sporting a boyish look was a fun thing, something that was both pleasing and comfortable, a nice way to signal interest for girls. As troon mania progressed, GNC style was 'poisoned' with the same logic i rejected in my early teens. I still dressed comfy and rather boyish but it wasn't the total retreat from 'how you look' (in favor of 'what you do/think') it once was. I was very aware of the 'poisoning' as it progressed and was very bothered by it, but everywhere i looked i was surrounded by weirdly girly neurotic TiFs. Sorry for the blogpost, no1currs but i'm sure many of you relate. I even think girly TiFs relate, it's pretty obvious to me they would have been much less feminine in their concerns and selfhood had they not come across trans identity, ironically. I've seen this weird paradox happen to TiFs and enbies over and over again
No. 2033682
>>2020800I am of the belief that sexuality of any kind is something that is influenced by both nature and nurture. I agree with the gay uncle hypothesis (people who do not have children may still increase the prevalence of their family's genes in future generations by providing resources to the children of their closest relatives), while also believing that it is possible to Pavlov someone into finding certain parts such as breasts, vaginas, penises etc attractive and get turned on upon viewing or thinking about them. The second one would be significantly harder to do but it is not impossible. It’s important to remember that genetic change in a species doesn’t have to be positively adaptive to end up being wide-spread, so homosexuality could end up being widespread without necessarily being beneficial in recreation. By the way I am not saying that homosexuality is morally wrong or inferior.
Though, a useful hypothesis regarding human sexuality will have to account for all human sexualities. So far, Jenny Graves' theory does this fairly well. Graves argues for re-framing the discussion around sexual attraction and genes in terms of which sex you prefer rather than same- or other-sex attraction. Her argument comes out of balanced polymorphism (expressed alleles can be advantageous enough in one circumstance to be selected for even if they are a disadvantage in other circumstances) and the specific balanced polymorphism category known as sexually antagonistic genes (genes that help one sex but not the other). In simpler terms, Graves’ model suggests that the male Kinsey-0 person and the female Kinsey-6 person are both alike in that their bodies have expressed female alleles to a huge degree compared to the extent they’ve expressed male alleles. Now what qualifies as male and female here doesn't solely have to do with reproductive organs but also secondary sexual characteristics, so someone attracted to a woman who has secondary sexual characteristics that are more commonly found in men, doesn't only expresses female alleles but a combination of both male and female. While a person who is attracted to women with many female secondary sexual characteristics expresses mostly female alleles.
No. 2033738
File: 1717425078188.jpg (181.44 KB, 1080x1362, Screenshot_20240603_162554_Ins…)
Why are they like this…
An ad for woxers popped up (womens boxer shorts/underwear basically) and of course some of the comments were shit like this.
No. 2033768
File: 1717427044642.png (702.32 KB, 960x882, guys who wanna fuck 2b.png)
>favourite hot tumblr tomboy lesbian is now injecting T
fuck this tranny earth she is just another cog in the insurance machine now and worse she's gonna be balding and toothless by 35. Literally the ugly male pysop equivalent for lesbisexual women. PAIN.
No. 2033864
File: 1717431931538.jpg (93.28 KB, 666x1000, 71YTcfqjEuL._AC_UF1000,1000_QL…)
>Find artist/gamedev creating colorful cats/wolves/dragons/dinosaurs
>"This is 100% a TIF"
>Click profile
>Top surgery update!
Every time. Why did all the cool nerd girls into art and animals troon out
No. 2034052
>>2033363This is because male is seen as the default while female is seen as a modified version of the default. It's why Disney will show male animal characters looking like regular cartoon animals and the female version is pink with bows and boob-coded chest fluff. It's why a woman can dress as a man but a man can't dress as a woman, "femanine" is an artifical modifier women are encouraged to adopt.
>>2034035A lot of autistic women are tomboys cause women's clothes aren't usually sensory friendly, it's usually fitted tighter, + I think socially conditioning "you are girl therefore you like pink and make up" doesn't work as well on autistic women. It just sucks not subscribing to female conditioning used to make you a subgenre of women "tomboy" but now selling shit like aesthetics and make up and skincare to women has gone so far to make womanhood into a thing you have to buy/perform that if you have no interest in it you should question if you're really even a woman
No. 2034177
>>2034035I don't think changing sexuality is possible but it may be possible to make a person respond to certain stimuli with arousal. I think it's easier for somebody to begin liking something rather than stop liking something. And that can be proven with addictions and fetishes alike. Addictions are more straightforward in how they function. If a person starts smoking, it becomes easier to start again even after stopping for a long period of time because connections have already been made. If you start doing something it's easier to repeat it again as the brain strives on habit. Some people are more prone to being addicted than others. Everyone can be but it depends on genetics too. Fetishes develop in a different way. Just like memories, the connections aren't always clear. You don't see A and your brain associates it with A. You see A and your brain associates it with C D O P D C. It wouldn't be possible to turn gay people straight or straight people gay but maybe they could be turned bisexual.
Also I'm just saying stuff here. It's not like I want this to happen. And it's not like I am correct. I might be wrong like all people are sometimes. There's no way that my first hypothesis (that it's nurture as well) will ever be tested morally and even if it is, it could be later used to harm homosexual people so it's much more preferable to see homosexuality as something you're born with. People above science always.
>>2034052Wrong reply?
No. 2034212
>>2033668Gosh I wonder why women would 'like and trust' TIMs less if they just came right out with their MRA/inceloid views about how much they actually identify with and support other men and can't empathize or sympathize with women. TIMs know they have to fake solidarity with actual women for women to trust them at all (and still the only women that trust them are usually the naive and innocent ones). Yeah of course if you admitted that you just 'coveted' dresses/your mom's underwear but actually think women are 'mean' for outing okc creeps and identify with the creeps more, women will 'trust' you less. That should be blindingly obvious. And it is, that's why these men LARP as woman-aligned when they're always 100% male-aligned.
Regarding the second part of your post yeah I relate a lot to what you're saying about the gender shit actually making me more self conscious and insecure about my appearance. I dressed in largely boyish/unisex clothes throughout childhood and tween age, then in my teens I switched to dressing hyperfeminine for social reasons and by the time I hit late high school I had stopped caring and was back to just a personal mix of style that was more about comfort and what I aesthetically liked than trying to project a specific 'gendered' image. I'm a younger millennial and the queer/gendie shit really hit around college in society and I just remember so many situations where friends felt the need to literally sit me down and 'call me out' on how I presented, telling me that I have a masculine personality, career path and interests so therefore it's 'confusing' and 'confused' for me to like skirts, dresses, printed clothing, or have long natural hair. This was all news to me because I always had super long hair my entire childhood and people would still call me masculine/boyish/a tomboy no problem, but suddenly around 20yo it was such a big problem people needed to 'sit down and have a talk' with me. I started not liking my 'curvy' (not fat, just boobs/hips) body because other people were critical of how my body looked too 'feminine' for my 'personality' and people suggested binding to me when I just said these are the clothes that fit my body type and look good on me. Like having expressed no genderfeels at all. It was incredibly jarring and made me incredibly self-conscious even though I had already worked through all my issues about 'gender typical clothing' years earlier because people couldn't stop pointing out how they felt my appearance was incongruous somehow. It was all so entirely unnecessary. Sorry for blog also.
No. 2034240
>>2033748Oh I'm the anon from above who said I didn't understand the Jenny Graves theory but if this is what she's saying it socially makes sense. I am still unclear on the evidence behind 'male' and 'female' alleles though. Women don't have any 'male' alleles since they have only X chromosomes. Does she just mean alleles associated with more male-typical or female-typical attractions or behavior? To my knowledge those haven't really been identified, but I can see how it might be a viable working theory although calling an allele on the X chromosome a 'male' allele seems silly to me.
From a social perspective though I agree, and always find it funny when lesbians and gay men are supposed to have some great level of 'solidarity' with each other when they have basically opposite behavioural traits especially when it comes to attraction and relationships. Like what are women who have no interest in men supposed to bond with men who have no interest in women about? Only the stigma around same-sex attraction itself but that's more of a political thing. Even as a primarily female-attracted bisexual I dropped a lot of female friendships out of sheer frustration at the amount of 'nigel bonding' I was expected to do.
No. 2034244
>>2034035I think forcibly conditioning sexuality on adults doesn't work, but I think conditioning that happens naturally over the course of adolescence actually may work and sometimes does work. This isn't like someone telling you to like dicks kind of conditioning, but I think sometimes people are able to condition themselves to like something or are conditioned by trauma not to like something they previously liked. I think most people's sexuality is pretty settled by late adolescence but prior to that I definitely think it's possible, not externally/by force though but if it happens in your own mind.
>>2034052AYRT (first one) and I know that's why, but it doesn't change the fact that being appearance-obsessed is an extremely female-socialized thing that is typical of girls who had girlhoods, and not typical of boyhood at all. Being obsessed with your aesthetic and hyperspecific about your looks and fashion as a tween or teen is a very female-typical behaviour or mental trait even if what you like is short hair and expertly styled 'tomboy' fashion. The fact that boys are more stigmatized for wearing skirts/dresses doesn't detract from this and imo it's a separate issue.
NTAYRT (second post) but I actually think that women with typically 'feminine' bodies usually find male clothes more uncomfortable. The pants don't fit right, the shirts don't fit right and they tend to be made of stiffer fabrics that are movement-unfriendly if you have bigger hips or boobs. I went from rarely wearing skirts/dresses as a preteen to literally never wearing pants (except sweats/PJ pants) in adulthood because they are just too physically restrictive and uncomfortable on my body type.
No. 2034437
File: 1717456933404.png (18.1 KB, 577x262, 3DEED946-40A6-4307-B616-4ADF84…)
TRAs genuinely don’t know what the fuck they’re talking abt kek
Their British and Brazilian strawman are based tho. The American one is bullshit because while I have met shotacon terfs they’re far and few inbetween and terfs are some of the most fiercely anti-pedophilia people I’ve met. I have also never seen a Holocaust denier terf ever
No. 2034463
>>2034437None of these retards remember what the RF in
terf stand for
No. 2034488
File: 1717458875086.jpeg (136.59 KB, 828x324, IMG_8503.jpeg)
>>2034437Shotacon lesbians?
No. 2034565
>>2032825Nonny I love this post/discussion. It put into words a lot of thoughts I had occasionally. It also made me reflect on myself (former tif). I was somewhere between the two types; I didn't care, and as I have grown up, the lack of caring has led to me being increasingly GNC in apparel too, because a lot of my more feminine apparel was gifts and purchases from family that I wore because I "had to". The tangled hair made me smile cause my hair was a rat's nest until I cut it-because short hair is very low maintenance so i can care even less-, and I had never seen this type of tomboy described so eloquently. I crossdress nearly full time now, but it's because men's clothes are simply more comfortable, easier to match, made of better materials, and have pockets. they don't always fit well, and you have to make sure they fit. I have seen some women say their body type does not permit it at all, like pants waistlines not fitting whatsoever, I suppose I'm lucky in that regard.
But I had a "fembrained tomboy" childhood pal. We both had nerdy interests but she was the fujo of both of us. Something that really stood out to me was how often she would verbally brag when an article of clothing she was wearing was from the men's section because not only was this less frequent from, but I never brought attention to it. It just kinda came naturally. She's far more feminine now, but also a themlet. We don't talk anymore.
I see more women like her troon out than me. I credit traditionalist third world upbringing for making me want to trans. My not caring made peers and authority figures see me as a failed woman, and the rest was a dysfunctional coping mechanism. As I have tried to wear "feminine" clothing I realize I truly do not like it because it's a sensory nightmare.
I ended up blogging but thank you for sharing this screencap nonita. the lolcor gender threads are a great tool to reflect. I've loved reading the other replies to your post too.
No. 2034567
>>2034534outside of self acceptance like the other nonas said, I've found it very helpful to seek friend groups with women who don't push you toward femininity or alienate you for your mannerisms. It's easier said than done, obviously, but not impossible. Seeing other people like you makes the loneliness less crushing or pervasive.
You can't fail at being a woman, that's how you were born. All you do is done as a woman and by that metric it's enough. And don't be afraid to push back and question when you get pressured, that scares people and they stop doing it kek
No. 2034669
File: 1717472725438.jpg (91.84 KB, 900x900, tumblr_5abec5b47c2132b20b33480…)
It's not just aesthetics that are constructed, either. Personalities and interests are too, but it's harder to fake. There are certain male social categories that are easier for the feminine socialised girl to recreate, actively effeminate gayish types, and androgynous geek types. As a fEmBrAiNeD tomboy trying to larp as a nerdy boy I gravitated to non-competitive video games and to fandoms, rather than military history and sorting algorithms as the boys I skinwalked were. IMO this is because we start out with some unknown level of innate sex differences- videospatial/movement/competitive/system-oriented masculine phenotype and language/empathetic/social-oriented feminine phenotype. Then we undergo socialisation that exaggerates that sexual dimorphism and throws in a number of totally cultural associations as well. So I hadn't been socially primed and possibly not neurologically inclined towards such interests.
Also here is a totally anecdotal possibly bullshit theory- much like men like to complain that the lack of a manly father figure is emasculating western boys, do you think it does the same to girls? I say that because my own father is a sensitive type who talks about his feelings at length, obsessed with other's approval, an ideological conformist, at the bottom end of the male social hierarchy, and so on.
No. 2034960
>>2032873Incredibly based.
>>2033362Yeah, there are TIFs who say that their conservative parents won’t let them have short hair or be masculine. Maybe I just have a chill family, but when I cut my hair short a few years ago, my Christian Republican relatives complimented it, and they don’t seem to have any problem with me being less feminine. As other anons have said before, a lot of rural conservative women are extremely tomboyish themselves.
>the whole dresses/pink = girl, no dress/blue = boy thing is a result of the recent TRA/new-conservatism crazeI think a big part of it is capitalism taking advantage of the trans trend. Someone in a YouTube comment section pointed out that while so many gendies claim to be socialist/Marxist, their entire identities are based around consumerism: gendered clothes, haircuts, etc. The whole movement is capitalism taken to the extreme.
>>2033365>never met a TIF who was ever into sportsAudrey Hale
>>2034669>sorting algorithmsKEK that’s such a random example, but it reminds me of a TIM I met who was into sorting algorithms.
No. 2034978
>>2034960Nonna I agree, I'm from a conservative religious culture and shit like short hair or 'tomboyish' clothes/interests was super normal in my culture. Both my parents and my extended family didn't think it was weird to have tomboyish clothing or behaviour. Actually I got shit talked by my conservative tradcath farming family for climbing a tree to show up my male cousins once, because I climbed the tree in a dress and they were like 'oh no you'll rip your dress, why don't you put on some coveralls or something!' Not because they thought the tree climbing to show up my male relatives was weird, but because they don't wear dresses on the farm.
I agree with you also about capitalism taking advantage of the trans trend. It used to be that even opposite sex siblings could wear each other's hand-me-downs when they were just t-shirts or simple sweaters or jackets, even jeans could be unisex for children that hadn't developed hips yet. But now if you have a son and then a daughter two years later you need to buy a whole new wardrobe for the daughter because god forbid boys and girls both wear the same colored t-shirt or something. I've had family friends with younger kids literally say they can't get their daughter to wear anything that is NOT pink or doesn't have Elsa from frozen on it. It's a total corpocap psyop at this point.
No. 2035023
File: 1717485883199.jpg (76.95 KB, 1200x639, Coop.jpg)
>>2034954>>2034959I know what it feels like. I once saw a tranny cashier at my local Co-op.
No. 2035037
File: 1717487105884.png (137.74 KB, 1080x1093, genderspectrum.png)
The "gender spectrum"
No. 2035085
File: 1717492432646.jpg (306.61 KB, 1080x1819, Screenshot_20240604_104436_Chr…)
No. 2035089
>>2035085>Hetero aro and ace people.I want off this ride. I want to ask how these people can say (or type) these things with a straight face but I'm pretty sure they are serious which is just tragic.
Interesting how the framing of this really highlights how ridiculous it is though.
>Lesbians who became straight men>Gay men who became straight womenThis is so far into the realm of reality denial it almost feels like satire. Like imagine knowing someone in real life who super seriously tells you 'I belong at pride because I used to be a gay man but now I'm a straight woman' lmao. People used to do that shit because their family/government would try to kill or excommunicate them if they didn't 'turn straight,' now it's the new super woke and progressive cause.
No. 2035201
>>2033362>>2033363i feel like i'm in the minority who
did grow up in an environment where any non-(hyper)feminine appearance was judged. i'm also from a catholic conservative europoor shithole and growing up i remember getting singled out for wearing "boy colours" and having a bob cut. kids (and some adults) around me were very strict on gender roles for the first 14 or so years of my life. i can confirm it fucks you up and makes you troon out because your brain just can't comprehend not wearing skirts and still being a woman.
No. 2035216
>>2035205zoomer, i remember this gender roles shit going back to kindergarten kek. i guess it was kind of worsened by the fact that up until high school gender segregation between students was the norm, if you were seen hanging out with a boy it was automatically assumed you were dating because male-female friendships just don't exist i guess?
as for the appearance standard, it feels kind of opposite for me, it's only recently that i've started seeing more women with shorter hair and boyish appearances. i do notice that yeah, gender roles have gotten stricter but in ways that are way different than what i grew up with.
No. 2035258
>>2034437Kek this one is a personal lolcow of mine. There are a couple edgy shota pseudo-'lesbians' (fujo lesbians) on xitter but he inflates their numbers to deflect from the blatant pedo/autopedo problem in troons. You can criticize twitter TERFs but they're not a fetish interest group, unlike troons where you have a 1/3 chance of stumbling on a diaperfag/lolicon. It always comes down to denying obvious sex differences
>>2034669True, i dislike fembrained/malebrained stuff because ultimately most people are a mix of both. There are trends like objects vs. people but even then, you can easily find women with typically 'people' interests (psychology, fashion as self-expression) who are very into sports or competitive gaming etc. It's a very infantile understanding of subtle sex differences. Often what distinguishes men from women is
how they approach certain things and situations, not solely
what they are interested in.
>do you think it does the same to girls?Not sure, but i'm conviced that poor mother-daughter relations are at the heart of TiF identification. A seemingly 'weak' or distant father (the latter being extremely common) might accentuate this. Overall, overbearing/BPD/
abusive mothers make it very hard to have a healthy female role model, on top of the very common tendency to demonize and never forgive one's mother.
>>2035201Same, i still get shit for not having hair so long it touches my waist. Also europoor, parents freaked out when i was allowed to pick my clothes and started dressing like a skater boy. They even thought i was going to troon out (i was interested in feminist/gender theory) and tried to throw away my wardrobe before i explained i wasn't going to do it. Still makes me kek to this day because i was actually a
TERF.
To comment on what
>>2033362 said, i think things became rapidly hyper-gendered after the early 2000s. If you look at pictures of students in the 2010s, there are so many gender markers like heavy makeup, tight sexualized clothing, boys who look like mini-men, a general 'reality tv' aesthetic. This wasn't a thing in the 80s or 90s, most teens wore baggy comfy stuff with ugly non-haircuts. I'm 90% certain this has something to do with the explosion of troondom in young millenials/early zoomers. Now that the trend is starting to die down, we are seeing a revival of baggy styles and girls are going back to neutral-looking comfy clothes.
No. 2035455
>>2032825When people say GNC they're referring to a plethora of things including behavior and appearance, mostly appearance. Overall it's not a checklist but rather a "what more of this quality you have than the other" so although the second girl was not GNC in caring about her appearance excessively, she was GNC in other ways. Both are gender non conforming, and in fact the second one is more GNC (if we are talking about an average set of behaviors), but the motivations differ.
First one is the type of person who cares more about practicality and does things because she wants to or because she likes to, second one relies on external feedback and does things not because she enjoys them (necessarily) but because she wants to be seen as doing that thing. Second one is disordered. There is always a cause for this, no matter how insignificant.
I guess the point shouldn't be that "TIFs are feminine in behavior" but "TIFs have problems".
No. 2035474
There's this desire, overall, to outmasculinize (for a lack of a better world) each other I noticed. Most replies are filled with personal anecdotes and experiences which, makes sense, it's the gender ideology vent- sorry, hate- thread. And it's a personal topic many can relate to, as they've been in these people's shoes or they have strong feelings about it for one reason or another. Rather than viewing this as masculine and feminine behavior, I choose to look at it as conforming vs non-conforming. Some people are proudly “outsiders” who value their own unusual perspectives and interests. There's many reasons for this too, which I won't get into, but it's what causes this desire to label these TIFs as feminine-brained whatever that is. And that's stupid in my opinion because we're all women so we're all feminine, but there's some behaviors who are more common than others.
There's nothing significant that separates people who become TIFs and those who don't. There are different reasons everytime but it can be summed up to this: There's a problem. This presents itself as a solution to a problem. Some people have chosen other solutions for theirs, some haven chosen this one. And because it looks like a solution it doesn't mean it always is.
No. 2035507
>>2034688>>2034787i've always gravitated towards anonymous or psuedoanonymous online spaces precisely because i don't have to worry about my sex or appearance/styling being accounted for in conversations where it's totally irrelevant. i infinitely prefer being in female-dominated versus male-dominated anonymous spaces because of the difference in board/discussion culture, but those are few and far between. i spent too much of my youth on 4chan for its anonymity, and its gross moid culture colored my young psyche negatively for some time
>>2034683>my fellow female history military autists existwould really love a military action & history thread in /ot/
No. 2035812
File: 1717532023778.jpg (86.42 KB, 571x796, middleme.jpg)
I just learned someone I interacted with very briefly in middle school is now a troon. They were super fucking weird about me and would harass our mutual friend who introduced us constantly about what I had been up to/ when I would hang out with them again/ etc.
Anyways I looked up photos and now he appears to be skinwalking me from middle school so… That's something I guess.
No. 2035817
>>2035455I think it's more gender nonconforming to not care about your appearance than to have a 'tomboy aesthetic' personally, because I don't think gender conformity or nonconformity is mainly about looks at all, I think it is mainly about everything else. It's also been common for half a century now at least for women and girls to curate what this poster is calling a 'tomboy aesthetic' and was never really associated with masculinity until recently. Honestly obsession with appearance is one of the single most female stereotyped/gender conforming things you can possibly do and that's the whole point of 'feminine performance.' It's not to specifically get women to look one certain way (trends change) but to get women and girls distracted and obsessed by making them fixate on their appearance. The masculine norm isn't just wearing 'boy clothes' but not caring about clothes, this is how boys are freed up to enjoy themselves and focus on their lives while girls are raised constantly distracted by and made self conscious about beauty and fashion norms.
I think this is also a large part of why AGP men always look so badly styled, they don't internalize any messages directed at women about beauty, fashion, or standards of appearance. They just want the shallow trappings of femininity for the fetishistic aspects.
>>2035474I agree that overall it's more about conformity in general than feminine or masculine traits. Personally I think whatever women do is feminine by default and whatever men do is masculine by default but I know that's not how most people use these words.
No. 2035984
>>2034534I really wouldnt worry about it. Your interests dont make you feminine. You're a woman & thats enough.
I also have a lot of male hobbys (tabletop wargames, warcraft, deep esoteric football knowledge) but thats just the gay shit I like. It doesnt even make me 'me of the guys'
No. 2036141
File: 1717549938295.jpeg (2.48 MB, 4032x3024, IMG_7422.jpeg)
saw this in a coffee shop the other day. i wouldn’t say i’m surprised that they managed to make this about them, but i am almost surprised that they’re so bold to publicly declare that this is akshually about twans rights
No. 2036401
>>2036141Did the coffee shop put this up themselves, or did some random person just tape it to the wall?
Also why couldn't they come up with something better than that ugly corporate art style
No. 2036477
>>2036460In the same way I know two tifs who
are the older sister, to compare.
No. 2036484
>>2036449You can either use the words feminine and masculine to describe 'sex stereotypes' or you can use them to describe things associated with the female and male sexes, respectively. Most modern discourse uses them to mean the former but I think it can be useful for women who have hangups about not being feminine enough to try to think about it as the latter. What you do is (of or related to the female sex) because you are female. All the rest is stereotypes, which conveniently change based on time period and location, sometimes extremely rapidly. There are lots of things that are naturally feminine that are not stereotypes, but we still call them feminine. For example, a feminine way of walking, or a feminine body. These do not refer to some patriarchal gender stereotype but to actual observable patterns and qualities related to how women look and move. In reality we sometimes conflate the two meanings and act like it's all the same thing, which is exactly what troons do (no, I have the female GENDER, because I FEEL like a woman, and it has nothing to do with a female body… which is why I need to get silicone implants right now and start taking female sex hormones!)
No. 2036518
>>2036510There are objectively feminine (female) bodies which represent half of the world's population and are clearly distinct from objectively masculine bodies which represent the other half. No women walk similarly to men because women have a different pelvic tilt/angle and different walking mechanics. You can go look at a race Caster Semenya and Margaret Wambui were in and see how the males run relative to the females, even though they are all trained to run in a very similar way the males have a completely different runs than their female competitors. All females, no exceptions, have feminine walks and bodies naturally. Everyone except possibly a few faceblind autists can tell they are female on sight, usually within a few milliseconds and often even out of their peripheral vision. Female voices can be soft or loud low or high but they all have a feminine timbre and are basically all distinct from male voices.
I was talking about actual, natural femininity and you are saying that it isn't real by… giving examples of stereotypes that have no basis in reality like 'the stereotype that women talk more'? You are proving my point. These stereotypes are false and make no sense so why would women feel insecure that they don't fit them?
The word 'feminine' literally means 'of or relating to the female sex/gender' as well as 'displaying stereotypes associated with the female sex' so both definitions are equally real and true ones, the problem is the 'stereotypes' definition is pointless to compare yourself to because it is fleeting and meaningless.
No. 2036524
File: 1717570466378.gif (1.79 MB, 800x600, girl-walk.gif)
>>2036519I think this is a case of sexual dimorphism being exaggerated through socialisation. Women will walk differently due to their biology, and since heterosexual males find that attractive, it incentivises women to play it up which is how you get picrel.
No. 2036535
>>2036523If you choose to ignore that one of the (commonly used) dictionary definitions of 'feminine' is 'of or relating to the female sex' and insist that it isn't used by people (even though it is) then I guess you're right. If we ignore the meaning of 'feminine' that is about natural female characteristics and if we ignore the fact that people use the word 'feminine' to refer to natural female qualities all the time as in 'a feminine body' then we can indeed claim that the only other definition of 'feminine' is the one pertaining to false stereotypes.
I don't need to gain anything but I was saying that it is useful and beneficial to women who don't feel 'feminine' enough and therefore they feel like 'failed women' to remind themselves that they are perfectly fine women, who are naturally 'feminine' in the ways that actually pertain to being female in any real way. The way in which they 'aren't feminine' is just that they don't live up to temporary stereotypes that actually have nothing to do with being a woman except that someone somewhere decided they temporarily should be associated with women. What have you failed at exactly?
No. 2036537
>>2036515Samefag
In a way this kind of TIF tend
not to pass
No. 2036544
>>2035474While I broadly agree with your point and notice this competition in tif spaces, I also think globalisation and several cultures have agreed on “feminine behaviours”, and the term is useful cause though the goal is to abolish gender entirely, we don’t exist outside of it yet. Across many cultures it is considered feminine to carefully monitor your appearance, because women are seen as decorative objects across many cultures. The normies won’t hesitate to slap labels on women who refuse to adhere to these beauty rituals and label us non-feminine. Conversely the nonitas here can accurately point out that curating a “tomboy” look by obsessing over your clothes and appearance is in fact complying with the expectations imposed on females, aka “feminine” gender roles.
These terms are bullshit in the same way the existence of money is bullshit if you think about it. Regardless it ends up being real in the sense that it does influence how you interact in social contexts.
Considering how many tomboys, especially of the type who really don’t care about their appearance, have several male friends, are very physical etc are rejected by parents, peers, religion, media etc I see nothing wrong with women who refuse to bend to these useless rituals to take it with pride. We’re constantly fighting the entirety of society and often get called pickmes for the crime of simply wanting to be comfortable. This type gets pushed to tif-ism because they feel othered by women, and it’s pretty disingenuous to pretend this doesn’t happen as female-on-female violence. How many mothers don’t impose these things on their daughters? Especially in very conservative societies like Eastern Europe, east Asia, Latin America, and so on. You are alienated by other women because even normies have gender super internalised. There’s often hefty homophobia interlaced in there too.
I wish gender did not exist at all and sex was the metric by which everything was measured but we don’t live in that society yet.
I actually think a lot of tifs are the carefully curated image type of person, which is why they compete to outdo each other, they’re overcompensating cause they’re fighting nature itself in their female body and the fact that a lot of them were fairly gender conforming women per the feminine standards of their society. But I can’t help but hold some spite toward them for being the type of woman that would have othered someone like me, and then trying to pass as “manly” in very low effort ways. And yes I think your average butch should be proud of how easily she mogs these wallflowers kek
No. 2036551
>>2036542>People talk about someone 'having a feminine form' 'a feminine body' 'a feminine voice' and stuff like that very often, not much less often than people talk about 'feminine clothing' or 'feminine hobbies.' All of these are based on cultural sex stereotypes. Try to describe them in your mind and you'll immediately notice it.
>Actually listen to when the word is used, even by troons, and you will notice that men often complain that something, like pregnancy or a period, is 'effortlessly feminine.'That one is because they fetishize the shit out of our biological realities. If stuffing ketchup-soaked balls of cotton up their axe wound gives them gender euphoria, to them it is "feminine". Troons are mentally ill and don't have a clear view of reality.
No. 2036563
>>2036545>they should think of themselves as actually feminineBut this is the problem, if you are constantly stereotyped as masculine by your surroundings, why try to think of yourself as actually feminine, when you could just accept the way you are without connecting it to terms used to describe stereotypes or secondary sex characteristics?
>lots of women sing in the tenor range and our voices are still feminineI was talking classical bel canto, where soprano is actually the most common female voice type
No. 2036570
>>2036557Yeah and I feel like you keep just ignoring the parts of my posts where I explain why I'm using the word that way. First of all, because that's the way the word is actually used in reality. I'm not a linguistic prescriptivist but a descriptivist, and since around half the time at least I hear the word 'feminine' used it is in the sense of 'biologically female trait' I don't think there is any point in pretending the word doesn't mean that. The word means what it means, i.e. what people use it to mean out in the real world.
Second, I was responding to a discussion started by an anon saying she feels inadequate because she doesn't feel feminine and feels like a 'failed' woman. Naturally you haven't 'failed' as a woman just by not fitting in with some false stereotypes, but realistically people's brains conflate the two different common 'meanings' of femininity (sex stereotypes and actual sex traits) so when people tell them 'you don't act like a stereotypical woman' they start to think 'people out in public probably mistake me for male, oh god, am I as ugly as a troon, am I missing some key part of womanhood other women have?' and the answer to that is always no. That's why I said women having these doubts should focus on the half of the meaning of 'femininity' that has to do with actual sex traits and try to ignore the 'sex stereotypes' half. No one thinks you're any less female because you don't fit a stereotype. They know you're female. You haven't failed some secret ritual of womanhood, you just don't fit a stereotype that is likely to be false.
No. 2036584
File: 1717572767897.jpg (Spoiler Image,110.49 KB, 736x919, f6c7e5e79141230634e9171bad3e87…)
>>2036566>2 meter tall woman with broad-shoulders, PCOS moustache, short hair, no makeup and stereotypically masculine way of dressing can be deemed by society as having "a feminine body".nta but that describes a lot of female bodybuilders (sans the height usually, since not even 99% of men reach that height) who take T to gain muscles and naturally get the other effects too, they are in fact still considered feminine in their body building scene. I've even met some with froggy voices.
Femininity is based on sex and sex stereotypes. Sex stereotypes are rooted in the biology of sex. Gender doesn't exist.
No. 2036592
>>2036580Yeah that's why I said almost no one will mistake you for a moid, some people who are faceblind/have perceptual issues or are not paying attention might briefly but that's not going to really affect you much overall.
Let me give another example of why I'm supporting the attitude I'm supporting. You hear often from TIFs that they were told they're 'masculine' throughout their lives so they thought their lives would be 'easier' if they just 'become' or LARP as men, since they think they'll fit in better with men since they're called 'masculine.' But what they actually experience when they pretend to be men is they don't fit in better at all and they basically always get clocked and even the people who don't instantly clock them always see them as 'hyperfeminine' men - not necessarily because of stereotypes like dress and feminine interests but literally just because of their body type, movements, voice, and so on. The thing these women missed when they decided trooning out will make them 'fit in' because they're masculine is that whenever people were calling them masculine, 'for a woman' was implied. They are perceived as masculine compared to the standard of the average women, not compared to the standard of all people. As soon as women like this realize that they're still (perceived as) 'feminine' in many ways just for having a female body and female experiences, the sooner they will stop deluding themselves they would have an easier life if they 'switched genders.'
No. 2036608
>>2036605That's not possible and the sooner people accept reality the better. If you read articles by or watch videos by detrans TIFs a major commonality between them is many of them say 'I wish someone had actually been honest with me before I transitioned and told me that I can't become male, I can't be perceived (and therefore treated) as a male no matter how hard I try to fit into stereotypes, I won't be accepted 'as a man' any more than I was accepted 'as a woman' and actually I was fine as I was all along.
The motivation of a large number of TIFs when they transition is to try to ultimately 'fit in with' and 'be perceived as' men because they think having some socially stereotyped 'masculine' qualities means they aren't proper women or aren't women at all. They don't understand that people calling a woman masculine is usually some form of social punishment for not conforming or stepping out of line of how society wants women to look or act, and that they aren't going to be punished any less if they try even harder not to conform, they're just going to be viewed as (and feel like) even more abnormal women. Actually a lot of women when they realize this detransition or desist and say they wish they'd realized it earlier.
No. 2036611
>>2036484I agree with almost everything you said though I'd like to mention that
>For example, a feminine way of walking, or a feminine body. These do not refer to some patriarchal gender stereotype but to actual observable patterns and qualities related to how women look and move. Given how deeply different boys are treated vs girls (we have data to show that pregnant women behave differently depending on the sex of the child while still in the womb if they know the birth sex) I think it's really hard to say with conviction that women/girls walk, speak and overall have different behaviours by virtue of being born a woman.
That is to say as well, these actions/behaviours aren't universal, and can be considered stereotypical given troons seem to love imitating their own version of them.
No. 2036619
>>2036611I think you can say that because like I said above the actual kinetics of how women walk (due to their pelvic angle, center of gravity, percent fast-twitch muscle fibers) is actually different. Same with vocal timbre, even women with low voices usually have identifiably female voices because of the size of their voicebox and thickness of vocal cords and so on, this is why most TIFs who take T get those froggy voices that sound at best like an adolescent boy when his voice starts cracking, because no amount of socialization or male hormone can give her male lung capacity/size even if the vocal cords change. You can also almost always get people to accurately blind test people's height based on their voice too again regardless of how deep or high it is. Female bodies always have different proportions than male bodies even if most women don't have that 'archetypal' hourglass figure that is usually called feminine, that archetype is kind of an extreme on the estrogenic development scale but due to BF percentage, bone structure and so on there are basically no instances where a woman's body or face can really be mistaken for a man's except by people with some sort of cognitive impairment like prospagnosia (in still photos it often happens, but it's not common in motion). Archaeologists can usually tell the sex of a skull just visually without having to do any DNA testing.
In terms of behaviours I think you're quite right, even sex stereotypes about behaviour that are accurate (meaning they do mostly apply to women or men) could be almost 100% nurture for all we know. It's really hard to tell things like that apart. But even feral children who grew up without parents in the forest will have identifiably male/female bodies, ways of walking and voices.
I wanted to specify though that I'm mainly talking about TIFs specifically when I say we can prevent them trooning out by reminding them they are 'real women' and perceived as such and not failures, i.e., they 'are feminine' to some degree just because they are female and a lot of what people consider 'femininity' is actually just 'biologically female sex traits.' I don't think this will work to stop TIMs transitioning because I think TIMs usually don't actually transition due to feeling like they're feminine/failed men, I think most TIMs transition for the coom and because they enjoy violating female spaces. This is obviously not the case with the vast majority of TIFs, they clearly become uncomfortable and disturbed by the fact they can't successfully infiltrate male spaces and be treated like some of the guys; many TIFs don't even try to hang out with men and continue to hang out in female spaces because they never even wanted to socialize with men, they just got convinced that they are male by virtue of fitting some masculine stereotypes.
No. 2036625
File: 1717576540845.png (489.82 KB, 980x671, edit.png)
No. 2036628
File: 1717576739576.jpg (59.28 KB, 850x400, quote-there-is-a-good-principl…)
>>2036625I like the simpler, edgier one
No. 2036647
>>2036636To be fair I didn't even see the joke cause I would 100% believe a chart like this saying that being controlling and
abusive is inherently feminine.
No. 2036662
>>2036657This reminds me of a really funny story with one of my friends who detransitioned/desisted (she got a scrip for hormones but I don't think she started taking them or if she did she stopped quickly).
She told me she identifies as male but she came to my show once where a bunch of people I knew from work and stuff showed up, so I was trying to introduce her to them. Her name was let's say Amanda but she said she 'couldn't decide' whether she wanted to be called 'A' or 'Zed' or continue to go by 'Amanda.' I started to introduce her and was like 'this is my friend ….' and looked at her to say which name she wanted to go by, she choked up and didn't answer and started giggling sheepishly. Everyone looked at her like she was a freak. She also told them she has 'he/him pronouns but you can use they if it makes you more comfortable.'
Literally the next day she told me she isn't going to go by a new name anymore and changed back to her normal name on facebook and was a theyby for a few months before going back to IDing as female, I think the social pressure got to her and she realized she couldn't actually be assertive about her new identity to strangers so she just slowly backed out of it.
Also around the same time I was working somewhere where we would test a bunch of people for something and before administering the test we had them do paperwork that asked for their gender and names. All like 6-7 TIFs we tested would sheepishly come over in the middle of doing their paperwork and ask me 'what should I put as my gender and name, X is my real name but I go by Y, also I'm trans' and I would just say 'just put down whatever you think you should put down.' Every single one of them put down their real name and 'F' usually with (NB) or (Nickname) next to it. They literally cave under the tiniest social pressure and most of them wouldn't even have successfully transitioned in the first place if they hadn't been hanging out entirely in hugboxes of other genderqueers.
No. 2036665
>>2036663Liberal city near the east coast. Well yeah I would think someone was acting super strange if they were asked to give their name and they paused for like a minute, started stuttering, and then just started giggling uncontrollably and never actually said the name. I ended up finally just saying all three names on her behalf after like a minute of this and she was like 'yeah any one of those is fine! You can call me whatever you want!' while at the same time she was texting me angry screeds after her therapy appointments about how her parents were
abusive because they should have known she was a man when she was a toddler, it was obvious, there's nothing feminine about her, and they just pretended not to know she was a male toddler because they were conservative. It's funny too because her parents supported her transition and kept being like 'yeah you are a man' so the only thing she could be mad about was that they hadn't 'magically known' by how 'masculine' she was.
No. 2036690
>>2036644The point is it's still "2% of a population". It's exactly the same, just on a smaller scale. If there's 2 trans people in a village of 100 people they'd still argue those trans people deserve to be catered to.
But also like if detransitioners are too small of a group to listen to, then the demi-boy autismgender transfem enby who is 0.5% of all trans people should have even less credence and authority but they still treat those as
valid voices.
Of course the 2% numbers aren't true at all. We already know up to 90% of "gender dysphoric" kids grow out of it with puberty, which would be a form of "detransition" to them.
No. 2036693
>>2036560A stereotype is a generalized belief about a particular category of people. So what you're saying is still a stereotype. And most of the things we say without really thinking about are generalizations. What you say that this is based on reality is true. But stereotypes hold some truth because they are the most common behavior that is observed among a group. There's going to be stereotypes because of humans' instinctive need to categorize and recognize patterns.
Now this isn't a reply to you, but a general opinion I'll voice:
The issue with stereotypes is that it creates an expectation and predicts behavior. A person, based on previous information they have about a particular group or person, will adjust their behavior. It's something as simple as seeing something the bus come by on specific hours every day, with some slight differences in time and predicting when it will arrive next. This process is useful. The way to break a stereotype is to show the person who holds that belief something more than the standard deviation. If the bus starts coming later for a few days, the person will at the beginning go early and be confused why the bus isn't at the stop yet, but will eventually adjust to the bus' new time.
The reason people get angry at stereotypes being proven untrue is the reason anyone would get frustrated at a bus that arrives and leaves at random times and follows no pattern. You can't predict when it will come next.
No. 2036696
>>2036690Exactly, if someone said "2% of prison inmates were wrongly convicted and later turned out not to be criminals" no one would say "who cares, that's just a minority of inmates who are already a small percentage of the population" they would say oh damn, how do we ensure fewer people get falsely convicted? When it's detransitioners it's just "haha suck it up losers."
>>2036689I think lots of TIFs are dumb but I still think we should help girls/women who are susceptible to becoming TIFs, both because a lot of them are vulnerable and most are minors or teenagers, and also because getting rid of stupid gender ideology thinking in women is inherently good for all women and will make us stronger as a group. Some of these girls/women have the potential to fight against harmful gender stereotypes if they can be made to realize that having stereotypically masculine traits isn't bad or wrong and shouldn't make them male-identified. It's a shame that girls who rebel against constrictive female sex stereotypes and norms end up identifying with men rather than using their experiences to realize those stereotypes are unhealthy for all other women too.
No. 2036699
>>2036693Most dictionaries define "stereotype" as an "oversimplied" belief about something, an "unfair and untrue" belief about a group or category, or something that is assumed to apply to every member of a category even though it doesn't apply to all of them. Feminine body/gait/etc. applies to 100% of females, no exceptions. That isn't a stereotype or generalization. Things that are stereotypes about women: women have long hair. Women like pink and dresses. Women are not assertive. Women are more interested in people than things. Things that are not stereotypes about women: Women have female gait. Women have female body proportions. Women do not have penises. As long as women feel they are 'inadequate' as women because they don't fit all generalizations about women, they are still missing the point.
I agree with you about why people get angry stereotypes don't come true but I think it's even more insidious than this on a mass societal level. Many (not all) stereotypes about women are basically things that women have been coerced to do because patriarchal society has deemed it useful for society (especially men) deems it useful for them to do so. Many women don't naturally do these things or want to do them and then when other people get angry that they don't do these things, these women start to feel like they have done something wrong because they don't fit into the expectations placed on them. Many of these expectations are not to their benefit and they actually would have better lives if they didn't do them or fit into the expectations, except due to feeling like it's 'wrong' not to fit these expectations they actually think they need to change or fix themselves and don't get to enjoy the benefits of standing up to those expectations. That's why TIF shit is so sad, these girls are miserable because they've been convinced they're wrong for enjoying some freedom from total conformity to standards that were devised specifically to keep them subservient.
No. 2036715
>>2036710I said this earlier but when you're told your body/gait isn't feminine people mean 'compared to other women.' As other anons said many women have exaggeratedly swaying walks either because they have wider hips than average, because they notice men are attracted to it or because they just saw other women in their family doing that as kids, who knows. But no woman has a gait that is naturally masculine in the way a man's is, it's just on the 'less than hyperfeminine' side of the spectrum of female walks.
This entire conversation is full of people fixated on how to define words because that's what half of gender arguments boil down to. It's people trying to mess with language and definitions in order to manipulate people and manipulate how society sees issues relating to gender. We got to this point because men want to be able to say 'prostate non-havers' and 'uterus havers' to erase the category of women. I don't think it's useful to fall for those manipulations and start ceding ground to troons who claim that akshully women don't have vaginas, their super feminine girl dick is actually so soft and feminine. Trying to 'gender-neutralize' biologically dimorphic traits while 'hyper-gendering' random stereotyped bs like arbitrary colors just plays into their agenda.
No. 2036727
>>2036722Samefag, but just to be clear, there is a difference between thinking
>I am female, therefore my being female is feminineand
>I am simply female, and femininity is a made up bullshit concept No. 2036734
>>2036722Insisting on a 'masculine' descriptor is equally ambiguous since when used, it can also mean multiple things. But what is calling yourself or other women 'masculine' actually accomplishing? What is 'secretly' feminine about women? The word 'feminine' was invented literally to refer to anything associated with women. Women are not 'secretly' feminine. During particularly conservative and reactionary periods in history (like 1950s America, when men were pissed that women took over a bunch of 'male' jobs while they were off at war) male patriarchal media and propaganda started shilling ideas of 'femininity' hard, replacing Rosie the Riveter type imagery (depicting strong handy women positively) with imagery and language about how women can be more 'feminine' aka demure, staying out of 'male' job fields, relegating themselves to domestic servitude, putting their 'new look' nu-Victorian corseted sexy dresses back on and their increasingly high heels. Men thus co-opted a word that really just meant 'anything related to women' and put a restrictive, stereotyped spin on it. However I'm just old enough to remember that in my early-ish childhood, we didn't talk about 'gender' much outside of grammar classes. We talked about 'sex stereotypes.' Now sex stereotypes and sex traits have been conflated under the umbrella of 'femininity' and 'masculinity' and people freely say a penis can be feminine, a color can be inherently feminine, whatever. We gave up more and more precise language to ideologically subversive males who hate women.
When a woman is emotionally attached to the idea of calling her personality, skillset, interests, body, walk, hair, and clothes 'masculine' why is she so attached to that 'masculine' label? I'll hazard a guess it's because most of us know that most of what we call 'masculine' are the good things. Comfort, freedom, respect, intellectually rigorous and higher paying career fields all come with the 'masculine' label and a lot of women want to be seen as 'masculine' for this reason. TIFs like to think they are 'masculine' because they hate 'femininity' and associate it with subjugation. But as soon as we start labeling our normal, non-sexed or female-sexed traits, bodies, careers, skills and behaviours 'masculine' unironically and feel insulted to be called feminine we are basically ceding ground to males by accepting that our positive traits are male-like.
There has always been a concept of femininity and a concept of gender, there have always been sex stereotypes and those things will never go away. You can say 'I am female and it's insulting to call my female body feminine' but feminine was originally just a word to describe 'female' and 'female associated' things, which you have now handed over to troons and scrotes and allowed them to define. Now we have tons of women fighting over who can be more 'masculine' i.e. interesting, comfortable, free, worthy and that sucks for little girls growing up. Being told 'sweetie that female scientist is masculine, it's unfeminine to be a scientist' isn't helping girls growing up because they know enough words to know that means she's 'man-like.'
No. 2036737
>>2036715>This entire conversation is full of people fixated on how to define words because that's what half of gender arguments boil down to. AMEN.
Women are adult human females. Stereotypes do not matter.
No. 2036769
>>2036544Great reply but i disagree that the 'weak and anxious' type of TiF can be reduced to feminine socialization. At least when it comes to the autistic ones. A lot of these girls try to be forgiven for their inability to be integrated into feminine socialization by adopting some superficial markers or carefully curating a persona. The 'trans boy' delusion is just a change of script. Autistic girls are often not masculine the way butches are, but they are still pretty 'un-feminine'. Un-feminine, un-masculine, with certain traits that are decidedly atypical like 'directness' and 'being oblivious to feminine micromanagement' etc. I think we can all see why they'd want to become 'something' for once. I don't see why a butch would be proud of mogging such girls because frankly, most people mog them when it comes to navigating gendered social scripts. There's nothing remarkable about that. Even in the pretty narrow autistic demographic, you'll find women who seem closer to the archetypal ex-tomboy/butch, despite their neurosis and identitarian fixation on being 'super duper masculine'. Idk i just don't think compliance to beauty standards is all that important when assessing gender conformity. It does symbolize something, but depending on what group you look at (lower classes vs. middle/upper class), feminine style doesn't automatically translate to feminine traits. It almost becomes magical thinking, and you end up with women who adopt a 'GNC trve feminist' uniform of sorts, are careful to not be ornamental or sensual, yet display a mastery of feminine social scripts (passive-agressive policing, etc.). Any feminist strand (outside of libfems) is riddled with such women.
No. 2036800
>>2036769AYRT, you’re correct actually. When I meant “fairly gender conforming by the feminine standards of their society” that encompasses the neuroticism, general submission and lack of taking up space, people pleasing… all the general ‘lower class person’ behaviours that are expected of women. You’re right that presentation doesn’t equal gnc (which was part of my point but I didn’t make it come across in my rant lol) because mtf troons have “feminine presentation” but are gender conforming when it comes to male standards, being fixated with sex and dominant through aggression. I actually think the type of feminist you describe that projects an outward image of gnc butch but is still neurotic and controlling is gender conforming in the way tifs are.
Regardless what you bring up about autistic tifs being neither here nor there- that also gets you othered by other women. The bar for women is so high that even if you miss out on one or two of the ridiculous high strung traits people already have things to say, and women monitor each other for noncompliance, it’s rather dystopian how we are taught to do this when you stop to think about it kek.
The reason why I place a special emphasis on butches/tomboys mogging these insecure women is because a lot of the tifs end up trying to project a very superficially masculine image by being extra aggressive, pushing really hard to wear “men’s clothes”, being misogynistic, and retroactively trying to frame themselves as always having been gnc to be more true trans. In a way, they’re appropriating the nature of the very women they would have excluded; some of these women despite being rejected themselves still feel threatened by other, less compliant women and reject them, in turn, trying to compensate for their own failings in an effort to belong. You’re correct that most everyone is more socially competent than this type of TiF though lol.
I hope what I’ve said about female group dynamics makes some sense. I think these female group dynamics are our equivalent to how male friend groups seem to operate in hierarchies where you’re constantly having to prove you’re not at the bottom. A lot of the, let’s call it Type 1 tomboy who never cared, also doesn’t really click with the in-group obsessive monitoring, and usually gets treated as either a strange pet project or a non-person you pity and reject by female social groups. It’s bizarre and dehumanising tbh
No. 2036858
>>2036800>The reason why I place a special emphasis on butches/tomboys mogging these insecure women (…)So true, it's almost comical when you contrast them with butches or tall/imposing women, who are often very soft and gentle 'beneath' their exterior. Insecure TiFs focus on interpersonal 'masculinity' over any other kind, and imo this is strongly related to their psychosexual issues (self-loathing, identification with the agressor, masochism or 'AAP'). They are also incredibly loyal to men, men's views of women and male culture, in a way that isn't dissimilar to masochistic (broadly, not just sexually) feminine women.
The bit about their rejection of less compliant women is also terribly true, simply because so many GC/gender-skeptical girls and women are also autistic. They have lots in common with the insecure TiF type, but do not engage in the pantomine of gender either because it'd demand too much effort or because they are non-conforming enough that even this seems silly. This fits a broader trend of awkward/autistic/unpopular kids ragging on kids who are even more odd than them, as a way to prop themselves up in the masculine/feminine hierarchy, as you described.
To me the quintessential Type 2 tomboy is overtly anxious, devoured by her inability to even relax and fit in in broader mixed-sex settings, unlike the Type 1 who copes with anxiety by simply ignoring her stress and not caring about feminine scripts (this is why they often have male friends). The Type 2 thrives in congregations of similarly anxious girls so she is the most susceptible to ROGD, and more generally an 'us vs. them' mentality. Of course there's a lot of overlap, i've seen super careless TiFs but most of these girls skew one way or the other.
>a lot of the, let’s call it Type 1 tomboy who never cared, also doesn’t really click with the in-group obsessive monitoring, and usually gets treated as either a strange pet project or a non-person (…)Yes, this is exactly the kind of dynamic i observed in tumblr fandom TiF days, where the 'leads' of the groups would be rather shy and awkward but still enforced rules over more careless 'pet' horse girl types.
I think the 'Type 1 tomboy' was bound to be theorized on here since so many LC users seem to fit this, given the accounts on /g/ and fandom discussions.
Also it's interesting that you associated feminine submission to 'lower class' women. I definitely see what you mean (especially in trad/religious groups), but i also observe the reverse, poor women covered in tons of makeup and garish feminine clothing acting extremely 'masculine'. Assessing femininity in these cases is hard because part of it is automatic scripting and a complete internalization of feminine norms, and part of it is very affected, a kind of sexual strategy women deploy in specific contexts.
>>2036824Oh yes, i don't think it's silly or entierely pointless, after all dressing sexy will get you the 'stupid vapid bimbo' treatment a lot of the time. I just disagree that this alone can extract a woman from deeply ingrained socialization.
No. 2037005
>>2036972i don't know if this is a popular theory or not, but i've debated this stuff before and me and several others agreed that many heterosexuals are actually bi, while those who self identify as homosexual usually are actually gay (with exceptions ofc, we all know about polilezzes and bi men claiming to be gay etc.)
the reasons for them still identifying as straight vary, but with regards to men, many seem to have a black and white view of sexuality - they're either straight or gay, regardless of their actual attraction. plus, homophobia by men against gay men likely dissuades some bisexual males from identifying as gay and pursuing men even if they're attracted to them. if they do end up in a same-sex relationship, they'll rarely call themselves bisexual and will instead just call themselves gay, because they, as closeted bisexuals, don't understand that homosexuals/heterosexuals don't have a "fluid" sexuality and that they truly do experience attraction to only one sex.
this also explains the phenomenon of "straight" males dating mtfs, and the rare few "gay" males dating ftms. they just don't understand how bisexuality works.
tl;dr: most moids are at least partially fags and also mentally handicapped retards who don't know what the word "bisexual" means
No. 2037030
>>2036858AYRT again.
Yes, the tumblr groups tend to operate not too differently from your average clique at a school when analysing it from the perspective of a teenager, which is very funny since a lot of them are NLOGs. I don’t think NLOGism is uncommon as a response to feeling othered by fellow women, I just think it fades with age and maturity in a healthy woman. A lot of Type 2s/in between autistic girls act not too different from your average popular girl when in a position of social power with other awkward reject girls. Before it was fanfiction archives and deviantart role play groups, now it’s clusters of tifs on discord kek
I also think the Type 1 is drawn to imageboards because a lot of our gnc comes from direct communication so we for better or for worse manage to mesh in places like 4chan, where male styles of communication dominate. This is obviously not good for the developing female psyche because a lot of male dominated spaces are misogynistic. But personally being surrounded by Type 1s is what I like about LC. It’s good for the mind to see other women like you.
Also this was an ESL slip but what I meant by lower class person was like, second class, less than human etc. Which is often the motivation to teach women to make themselves small, keep to their own, prioritise others above themselves, a lot of that comes from those days. But your observation on economic class is spot on!! Poverty means striving to survive and that means being unafraid to defend yourself and be aggressive which accidentally comes across as “masculine”
No. 2037267
>>2036858Oh I just responded to AYRT saying almost the exact same thing you said and then read your post. I think this is especially accurate:
>quintessential Type 2 tomboy is overtly anxious, devoured by her inability to even relax and fit in in broader mixed-sex settings, unlike the Type 1 who copes with anxiety by simply ignoring her stress and not caring about feminine scripts.The us vs. them mentality part is also very true, and I think this is why most Type 1 tomboys grow up without gender trouble, because they are not nearly as obsessed with categorizing and classifying themselves in relation to other people. Even if someone bullies them for being masculine they're less likely to care because they haven't internalized these neuroses to the same degree and don't feel the need to set themselves apart more and more from other people, which is really at the root of a lot of ROGD. It's actually a form of hyper-conformity to expectations and roles, where girls who don't fit nearly into the prescribed role search around for a role they think they can fit perfectly; this is where micro-identities come from.
No. 2037271
File: 1717619011238.png (57.75 KB, 685x645, 2024-06-05 at 21-17-32.png)
"Afab privileged people" Jesus Christ.
Imagine seeing a post about Palestinian women not having access to pregnancy care, reproductive care, menstrual products, etc, due to living in a literal war zone, and THIS being your response. Troons are genuinely the most self-absorbed people I've ever seen, and the fact women are bowing down to them and apologizing instead of going "what the fuck is afab privilege, shut up" is so worrying tbh. We're cooked, man.
No. 2037296
>>2037280Yes that's what initially struck me about the 'queer community' when it started focusing so much on gender identities, it was so hyper-conformist and restrictive.
Maybe the solution to the feminine/masculine question is actually to just go back to describing non-stereotypical qualities as 'GNC' - that makes it pretty clear it doesn't talk about your body type or PCOS but about roles you're not conforming to, and the nonconformity doesn't mean you are masculine it just means you're not conforming to a role.
Slightly off topic but the same types of nerd girls who now adopt microidentities on Tiktok are the same types of girls who I noticed always had a lot of mental angst and anguish about not having a 'perfectly curated' aesthetic in their wardrobe, bedroom, etc. or would call themselves 'asexual' just because they didn't get immediately turned on by a hot guy they saw passing on the street, it's this extremely literal and rigid idea of having to have your outside and labels match your insides perfectly.
No. 2037314
>>2034669How many times do we have to explain that the brain isn't a sexed organ? The only difference is its size, which correlates with skull size and has nothing to do with intelligence. Playing competitive games isn't inherently male; it's just less popular with girls and women because men will insult them for "invading" their precious male safe space, proof of their supposed superiority, because "only men have the much cerebral capacities to play competitively". Enjoying stereotypically male hobbies doesn't mean someone has a "male brain." Similarly, gay men are more likely to enjoy stereotypically female hobbies because they find acceptance there, not because they have a "female brain."
The insane theories that trans women are women trapped in male bodies or that gay men have female brains are based on the same bullshit and have been debunked repeatedly by science. It's 2024, wake the fuck up nonna. As a woman with stereotypically male hobbies, it's incredibly insulting and misogynistic. These ideas are harmful and should not be tolerated. Don't project your insecurities about YOUR hobbies on others. A girl or woman enjoying stereotypically hobbies isn't secretly male.
No. 2037377
>>2037374This is troon logic. "No trust me guys I'm really like more biologically male than males, the width of my hips means I was born with a male pelvic shape and angle, I could totally beat men at sprinting because I don't run in a female way!" This is exactly what delusional troons say and you're falling for their psyop.
Sex characteristics are partly a result of hormonal development but even people who are legitimately intersex (a tiny proportion of the total population) still are either biologically male or female and it's not hard to determine which. There's no crossover at all between male and female pelvic angle and shape. Chromosomes aren't even the sole determinant of being male or female since some intersex conditions cause people to develop biologically 'female' phenotype even though you will be sterile.
People use feminine to mean 'female related' all the time. Best example is 'feminine hygiene products,' no one is saying tampons are frilly and sing in a soprano voice they're saying they're hygiene products for a 'feminine' (related to womanhood) biological reality.
No. 2037866
>>2037858I think in the first couple years it was a fun microblogging platform like a weird combo of blogspot facebook and insta. It went downhill so fast as soon as it got political though since they picked up the anti-
TERF shit faster than any other social media platform. I think I deleted my tumblr in the early 2010s and at that point I had already been dealing with 2+ years of
TERF blocklist posts. On the bright side tumblr is also what peaked me, the
TERF blocklist posts included the most absolutely innocuous blogs.
No. 2037997
>>2037994How is my reasoning faulty all I am saying is that both the etymological origin (and use for hundreds of years) and the current use of the words 'feminine' and 'masculine' are frequently consistent with the meaning 'of woman' and 'of man.'
If you think physiological kinetics don't matter I'm sure you don't mind male sprinters in women's olympic sprinting events? Yes the only time we should point out the differences between males/females is when women have baby.
No. 2038012
File: 1717659448849.jpg (148.2 KB, 700x817, differences_between_male_and_f…)
>>2037374>my pelvis is narrower than both the majority of people, men and women. I do not run “female”. since sex characteristics are a result of hormonal development, a variable characteristic, so obviously there is crossover.You thinking being petite and having a smaller pelvis (when women are literally the smaller sex) makes you "more male" and "less female" is just tragic. I think you're a bit brainwashed by the troon ideology too, the first puberty happens in the womb before we are born. Troons have succeeded in spreading lies like "everyone starts out as female in the womb" and "kids are basically the same until puberty" which was never true to begin with.
Males muscles aren't attached the same way as females, the shape, size and angle of their bones are different. It doesn't scale proportionally; a super tiny change in how the ligaments are attached makes men not just a tiny bit stronger, but several times stronger than women (similarly to the lever effect). And that's all true before puberty has even hit. Males are designed for upper body strength, women have other functions that males don't.
No. 2038061
>>2038012Thanks nonna I feel like I'm going crazy reading posts in this thread implying that women can basically have male phenotypes and the only difference between us is detectable in our chromosomes. The idea that acknowledging phenotypic sex differences is bioessentialism similar to race-sperging suggests that troon ideology has poisoned basic science education and awareness more than I even realized.
Even the 'men are taller on average, but many women are taller than men' thing, while true, is losing sight of the fact that relatively common heights for females (like 5'0-ish) are basically unheard of for men and vice versa, even though that is a dimension where men and women do have significant overlap. Chromosomes aren't even the most legitimate way to determine sex since for example you can have phenotypic females with XY and inactivated SRY who develop phenotypically much closer to a typical female, so arguably it's not the chromosomes that are the be-all end-all of sex determinism.
No. 2038127
>>2036628Ancient Greeks were homos, more news at 11.
>>2036556It just means you're autistic.
>>2037858Tumblr is still great for art and niche translation projects.
No. 2038211
>>2038170Watch any interview on youtube by Helen Joyce and pick up her book Trans: When Ideology Meets Reality. Also, see the links here:
https://www.transgendertrend.com/useful-links/What are you actual questions about it? Im at work though so it may be while before I can comment again.
No. 2038218
>>2038170https://shrimpfeelings.substack.com/p/how-a-social-justice-echo-chamberhttps://newthoughtcrime.com/https://haveyouheardabout.peakerscorner.org/cms/https://theupheaval.substack.com/p/are-we-in-a-500-year-religious-revolution (This isn’t an essay about how transgenderism is bad because Jesus said so, it’s an essay about how woke ideology has become a substitute for having traditional religious beliefs among liberals)
It sucks to realize that you’ve been duped by a cult but I bet a lot of us in this thread were once in your shoes. I peaked 2 years ago and lost a lot of friends because I couldn’t keep my mouth shut about how bullshit trans ideology is once I realized it, but I’m OK now. I focused on some new hobbies and made new friends, and now my life is better overall (I still come here to vent because I’m at a very woke workplace with tranny coworkers and trans cult member coworkers who still drink the Kool-Aid).
No. 2038237
>>2037377>>2038012wow, some anons itt are being a little schizo. when did i say i was anything like a male? i am feminine, but no matter how much you try to pull out diagrams of skeletons it’s not going to change the fact i have a very small pelvis in terms of size as well as compared to the rest of my body. people can vary. the reason why dimorphism begins before puberty is because hormonal development begins from the very start, at conception. yes, what you’re saying is troon logic, because there IS crossover, and using narrow autist-level definitions is what makes retards feel as though they don’t “fit in their gender” in the first place. stop trying to gaslight people into believing everyone akshually always look like textbook for their gender. i am female because I am XX, that is all.
that being said, whether or not you disagree doesn’t matter to me much - what bothers me is the implication some anons have that cultural femininity stems from biology. those are completely different things.
No. 2038272
File: 1717684244297.jpg (20.92 KB, 474x520, 1000018481.jpg)
Am I retarded or not getting something if I do agree that woman = somebody who identifies as a woman? Isn't it just basic gender study that woman and man are gender roles, and female and male are biological realities, thus a male can identify as a woman and technically 'be one' because gender is constructed from stereotypes and vice versa. That doesn't mean I support trans-identified men because it is disgusting that they take harmful sex-based stereotypes that is basis in the oppression of females and play dress up with them. I just think gender as a concept is retarded, especially how troonism enforces extremely conservative gender roles while trying to come off as progressive. I don't 'identify' as a gender because it's something non-innate that's imposed upon sexes, I just know I'm female. The enmeshing of gender = synonymous with sex that tranny ideology is trying to push is the most harmful and annoying part, because it's called transGENDER. Aiden is not a homosexual man if he likes males because he was born female, and sexuality is the attraction of SEX, not gender. Female that identifies as a man who is attracted to males is obvious heterosexuality and it actually drives me crazy when people are confused. It's honestly disheartening how fucking retarded people have gotten in terms of gender/sex, like FEMALE bathrooms accomodating males who identify as women, while sex and gender is a completely different concept. Sorry for the incoherence and if I restated obvious points, I'm just trying to figure it all out for myself.
No. 2038290
>>2038170>>2038211Thank you!
>>2038211>Why shouldn't I be kind to someone who is in pain and wants to be genuinely themselves?
>There are horrible people in every group, nation, organization, etc. This site is critical of trans people so it's not surprising that people cherry-pick the worst offenders to support their stance. How is this much different than, let's say, some dumb racist or homophobic hate groups?
To be honest my biggest question is why I was so blind to the most egregious shit like the self-id laws and the horrendous consequences for women in prisons and sports? Why did I think that was fine? This isn't some whackadoo twitter nuts but INSTITUTIONS supported by the government and general public opinion! I was doing all the right things that everyone was telling me to do and I ended up supporting some dystopian nightmare shit. My deep desire to do the right thing led to that.
What the fuck.
No. 2038302
>>2038290that would be the combo of female socialization (putting down your own rights and safety for a group that claims to be oppressed) and slowly being desensitized to how insane shit has gotten. the pipeline of "it's okay to call this feminine man a she because he's mentally ill and it helps him!" to "actually there is no biological difference between males and females and sex isn't real you fucking
terf" comes for you pretty quickly, i don't care if it's an overused comparison but it's basically cult indoctrination to a T
kek No. 2038307
>>2038272>>2038285Woman = adult human female
Just like how you can't call a lioness a woman, because that's a female lion not a human. Can't call a hen a woman because that's a female chicken not a human.
Gender is retarded but so are you (OP)
No. 2038329
>>2038307nta but there is no “lionnesshood” as an enforced concept like there is “womanhood”. I’d love if “femaleness” and “womanness” were ACTUALLY considered identical by society like they’re meant to be but throughout history women have been considered more or less of a woman regardless of the fact we’re all the same sex… Let’s be real. The reality is imo to abolish troonism we need to abolish the prevalence of gender stereotypes in the first place - make “woman” just mean “female” again, instead of a whole lot of other things on top of that - THAT is the cause of people “identifying as” or “feeling like” a gender, even down to the physical transition. TiFs don’t transition to
be a male (that is impossible) they transition to be perceived as a man is in society. That much is obvious.
No. 2038334
File: 1717687438706.jpeg (23.01 KB, 525x414, whattheheeeeeellllllllllll.jpe…)
>>2038302Female socialization? Fuck, I just thought that was being a decent human. I'm assuming that some of the sources provided by others will go into it more.
Thanks everybody for responding. This shit is horrible right now. No wonder lots of people who get confronted with this start to double down with the trans line. Having to really look into this is awful and I feel like it's all my fault.
Prob female socialization to blame myself too, huh.
No. 2038341
>>2038290>Why shouldn't I be kind to someone who is in pain and wants to be genuinely themselves? It’s a question of how you define “being kind”. Of course you shouldn’t deny a man in a dress housing or food stamps or open heart surgery just because he wears a dress. But when trans ideology supporters say “be kind and let trans women into women’s locker rooms” or “be kind and let trans women compete in women’s MMA boxing” then they’re not asking you to be kind, they’re asking to invade women’s spaces and telling you to shut up and not complain about it - or else. Also, if you’ve ever had a friend or relative who’s addicted to drugs or alcohol, there’s a point when “being kind” becomes about cutting them off from their addictive substances, and they’ll hate you for it, claiming that they need the drugs or alcohol to function and make them feel better. For a lot of trans people, crossdressing, denying reality, and getting high off of validation and praise from supporters is like an addiction, and if you don’t feed into their addiction they will hate you for it (even if their addiction is hurting them). Heck, for TIFs, testosterone is literally a performance-enhancing drug (that causes bad long term health problems in women), so is it really “being kind” to encourage or enable them to continue putting it into their bodies?
>There are horrible people in every group, nation, organization, etc. This site is critical of trans people so it's not surprising that people cherry-pick the worst offenders to support their stance. How is this much different than, let's say, some dumb racist or homophobic hate groups?That is true, but at the end of the day men are not women, and men can never become women, and it’s not hatred to speak this basic truth. Yet how many places exist on the internet or IRL where you’re allowed to admit this basic truth without immediately being called a hateful evil bigot genocide-supporter transphobic Nazi?
No. 2038396
>>2038341This all is so embarrassingly obvious reading it now.
Especially the second point, crucified for just stating a biological reality.
I'm going to have to look at all the information that I've gotten from trans friends and compare it to what anons have suggested here. I think one big fuck up for me was to just follow the "good" crowd instead of taking the time to fucking think for myself.
Even now I'm thinking of a friend who just doesn't "feel" like a woman. What does that even mean? I didn't challenge them on it because I thought it was some super special trans thing. But I don't feel like a woman ever. It's not a feeling, I just am. Just like the color of my skin or eyes or any other immutable quality. The only "feeling" I get around being a woman is how people treat me. So if people are treating me like shit because I am a woman, they need to change their behavior. This is hard since there are so many ingrained sexist expectations just day to day, maybe my friend took the easier route to escape. Instantly became so much more popular and supported. But at what cost?
No. 2038406
>>2038272>Isn't it just basic gender study that woman and man are gender roles, and female and male are biological realities, thus a male can identify as a woman and technically 'be one' because gender is constructed from stereotypes and vice versa. Even if "woman" the gender and "female" the sex are different, how could a male have the woman gender or a female have the man gender? If gender is a socially constructed set of stereotypes, it still isn't really an internal identity that you can pick and choose. Gender is the set of rules society imposes on you based on your sex. I can identify as a man if I want to, but I'm visibly female so I will never actually BE a man because nobody is going to truly treat me as a man, they'll treat me as a woman with pronouns. As a child I received female socialization and no amount of identifying as not a woman will erase that from my psyche. Even if I pass as male I'm still not having the experience of being a "real man", because men don't need to put in tons of work and effort to pass as male, they just naturally receive the "man" gender role because they are male.
Look at the way TIMs talk over TIFs and dominate every single trans space, and look at the way TIFs meekly allow it and apologize for their AFAB privilege. It's the same traditional man/woman social dynamic even if the dress code is reversed.
No. 2038420
>>2038272The key issue is seeing “gender” as a meaningful concept at all. Yes, notions of gender are based entirely on stereotypes and social expectations: that’s why it’s bullshit.
A woman is a woman regardless if she presents herself masculinely or femininely. If gender is equal to the performance of stereotypes, then what is the difference between a woman who cuts her hair short and wears pants and a transman? The answer is the only difference is that one calls herself a woman, and the other calls herself a man. This distinction is purely superficial, because we can see these two women are otherwise identical. Similarly, even though a transman and a cis man both call themselves men, we understand the actual biological and social differences between these two.
Understanding that transgenderism is bullshit is about understanding that all gender roles are bullshit. We are socially shaped by the way we are raised in relation to our sex, and this does not change even if you change your pronouns.
No. 2038488
File: 1717694903021.png (14.55 KB, 322x156, 1.png)
>>2038431Just found this in a Q&A he did. Song is still based though.
No. 2038492
File: 1717695014340.jpg (46.22 KB, 1079x1173, mfw.jpg)
How do you clock troons? What characteristics/mannerisms set off your alarm bells? I'm an autist and I have a really hard time distinguishing facial features/dimorphic(?) features, but I want to know what to look out for. Even after lurking in the FTM and MTF threads for around a year now, I still have trouble, unless its the AGP's that put absolutely no effort into passing (e.g. balding old man with visible stubble wearing tight dresses). I struggle even when seeing them in real life and not just a perfectly posed/filtered selfie, because I just assume they are kinda ugly masculine woman/kinda ugly short effeminate men. For example, the troon in this video
>>2038162 looks so much like a male and I have no idea what gives off that she's a TiF apart from the fact that the video was about her transition. The only time I could tell that someone was a troon was when I felt an overall "uncanny" vibe when I was around them but I couldn't exactly place what it was that felt incongruent about them, and I only figured it out a day later when they casually mentioned someone "misgendering" them in a conversation. I know the voice is also a telltale sign, but I also struggle with identifying the signature "tranny vocal fry" or if it's just a regular person that has a weird voice. Thank you in advance nonas